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9th grader arrested for bringing home made clock to school

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  • #176526

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    Did the school overreact? Was it just because he has a middle eastern name?

    http://www.dallasnews.com/news/community-news/northwest-dallas-county/headlines/20150915-irving-9th-grader-arrested-after-taking-homemade-clock-to-school.ece

    [IMG]http://www.dallasnews.com/news/community-news/northwest-dallas-county/headlines/20150915-nmc_15mohamedahmed2.ece/BINARY/w940/NMC_15MohamedAhmed2[/IMG]

    Update at 9:32 a.m. Wednesday: After the story of Ahmed Mohamed’s arrest for bringing a homemade digital clock to school went viral Tuesday, triggering an outpouring of support for him on social media, Ahmed tweeted a thank-you early Wednesday.

    Original story:

    IRVING — Ahmed Mohamed — who makes his own radios and repairs his own go-kart — hoped to impress his teachers when he brought a homemade clock to MacArthur High on Monday.

    Instead, the school phoned police about Ahmed’s circuit-stuffed pencil case.

    So the 14-year-old missed the student council meeting and took a trip in handcuffs to juvenile detention. His clock now sits in an evidence room. Police say they may yet charge him with making a hoax bomb — though they acknowledge he told everyone who would listen that it’s a clock.

    In the meantime, Ahmed’s been suspended, his father is upset and the Council on American-Islamic Relations is once again eyeing claims of Islamophobia in Irving.

    Box of circuit boards

    A box full of circuit boards sits at the foot of Ahmed’s small bed in central Irving. His door marks the border where the Mohamed family’s cramped but lavishly decorated house begins to look like the back room at RadioShack.

    “Here in high school, none of the teachers know what I can do,” Ahmed said, fiddling with a cable while a soldering iron dangled from the shelf behind him.

    He loved robotics club in middle school and was searching for a similar niche in his first few weeks of high school.

    So he decided to do what he’s always done: He built something.

    Ahmed’s clock was hardly his most elaborate creation. He said he threw it together in about 20 minutes before bedtime on Sunday: a circuit board and power supply wired to a digital display, all strapped inside a case with a tiger hologram on the front.

    He showed it to his engineering teacher first thing Monday morning and didn’t get quite the reaction he’d hoped for.

    “He was like, ‘That’s really nice,’” Ahmed said. “‘I would advise you not to show any other teachers.’”

    He kept the clock inside his school bag in English class, but the teacher complained when the alarm beeped in the middle of a lesson. Ahmed brought his invention up to show her afterward.

    “She was like, it looks like a bomb,” he said.

    “I told her, ‘It doesn’t look like a bomb to me.’”

    The teacher kept the clock. When the principal and a police officer pulled Ahmed out of sixth period, he suspected he wouldn’t get it back.

    They led Ahmed into a room where four other police officers waited. He said an officer he’d never seen before leaned back in his chair and remarked: “Yup. That’s who I thought it was.”

    Ahmed felt suddenly conscious of his brown skin and his name — one of the most common in the Muslim religion. But the police kept him busy with questions.

    The bell rang at least twice, he said, while the officers searched his belongings and questioned his intentions. The principal threatened to expel him if he didn’t make a written statement, he said.

    “They were like, ‘So you tried to make a bomb?’” Ahmed said.

    “I told them no, I was trying to make a clock.”

    “He said, ‘It looks like a movie bomb to me.’”

    Police skepticism

    Ahmed never claimed his device was anything but a clock, said police spokesman James McLellan. And police have no reason to think it was dangerous. But officers still didn’t believe Ahmed was giving them the whole story.

    “We have no information that he claimed it was a bomb,” McLellan said. “He kept maintaining it was a clock, but there was no broader explanation.”

    Asked what broader explanation the boy could have given, the spokesman explained:

    “It could reasonably be mistaken as a device if left in a bathroom or under a car. The concern was, what was this thing built for? Do we take him into custody?”

    Police led Ahmed out of MacArthur about 3 p.m., his hands cuffed behind him and an officer on each arm. A few students gaped in the halls. He remembers the shocked expression of his student counselor — the one “who knows I’m a good boy.”

    Ahmed was spared the inside of a cell. The police sent him out of the juvenile detention center to meet his parents shortly after taking his fingerprints.

    They’re still investigating the case, and Ahmed hasn’t been back to school. His family said the principal suspended him for three days.

    “They thought, ‘How could someone like this build something like this unless it’s a threat?’” Ahmed said.

    MacArthur Principal Letter to Parents

    An Irving ISD statement gave no details about the case, citing student privacy laws. But a letter addressed to “Parents/Guardians” and signed by MacArthur Principal Dan Cummings said Irving police had “responded to a suspicious-looking item on campus” and had determined that “the item … did not pose a threat to your child’s safety.”

    ‘Invent good things’

    “He just wants to invent good things for mankind,” said Ahmed’s father, Mohamed Elhassan Mohamed, who immigrated from Sudan and occasionally returns there to run for president. “But because his name is Mohamed and because of Sept. 11, I think my son got mistreated.”

    Mohamed is familiar with anti-Islamic politics. He once made national headlines for debating a Florida pastor who burned a Quran.

    But he wasn’t paying much attention this summer when Irving Mayor Beth Van Duyne became a national celebrity in anti-Islamic circles, fueling rumors in speeches that the religious minority was plotting to usurp American laws.

    However, the Council on American-Islamic Relations took note.

    “This all raises a red flag for us: how Irving’s government entities are operating in the current climate,” said Alia Salem, who directs the council’s North Texas chapter and has spoken to lawyers about Ahmed’s arrest.

    “We’re still investigating,” she said, “but it seems pretty egregious.”

    Meanwhile, Ahmed is sitting home in his bedroom, tinkering with old gears and electrical converters, pronouncing words like “ethnicity” for what sounds like the first time.

    He’s vowed never to take an invention to school again.

  • #286402

    newmom
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    Just because adults see it and think “BOMB!” doesn’t mean this kid was thinking bomb. It sounds like he was bored and wanted to build something and so built a clock. Sometimes it’s really as simple as things sound and not a sinister plot. Poor kid.

  • #286314

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    Do you think if the kid was not middle eastern that this happens? Do people from the Mideast scare Americans?

  • #286358

    LC
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    Apparently his father is no stranger to political activism, that may have been a factor. Like any story that involves a school, we have no idea of the specifics because they can’t release much information. On the surface it seems that cuffing and arresting was extreme, but there may be good reasons–or it could be Texas. In any event, I’m pretty sure the people falling all over themselves with #IstandwithAhmed would be the first ones screaming about school incompetencies if they didn’t take anything that could be a bomb very seriously.

    We’ve always joked about giving the folks on watch at Folsom Dam some boredom relief by wearing turbans and taking the boats out near the boundary line and fishing. Of course, if they ever said anything we’d just say they were head/sun protection. I’m thinking there may be some similarities here with young Ahmed.

  • #286315

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    Nothing wrong with taking it seriously. Not sure why he would need to be cuffed. Just have him sit in the chair. Looking at him I don’t think he’s a physical threat. There were I think 4 cops there. If this is a black kid who brought this, I don’t think anything happens. It’s the world we live in. Anyone who says they have been somewhere after 9/11 and saw some muslim people and didn’t think about 9/11 is a liar. Doesn’t make you a racist.

  • #286403

    newmom
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    @EGL Admin 117360 wrote:

    Do you think if the kid was not middle eastern that this happens? Do people from the Mideast scare Americans?

    I don’t think being middle eastern was the problem, but I don’t know Texas that well either. I think the school and police can’t fathom why a kid would want to do something like build a clock from scratch just for fun. If the article is correct, it seems as if they believed there must be some reason for building a home made clock. There was no reason to take him out of school in cuffs, suspend him from school, and take him to juvie. Look at his academic record. Talk to his engineering teacher. Does the kid of a history of causing problems, or a history of building things for fun?

  • #286485

    plasmadrive
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    Well, if it was just a clock circuit board, the school and the cops were idiots. Remember, the kid showed an instructor earlier and that instructor knew what it was. Why didn’t they just ask?

    I assume there must be something missing from this story, but what? If there isn’t, it is going to become a very expensive lesson for the tax payers.

  • #286316

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    @newmom 117367 wrote:

    I don’t think being middle eastern was the problem, but I don’t know Texas that well either. I think the school and police can’t fathom why a kid would want to do something like build a clock from scratch just for fun. If the article is correct, it seems as if they believed there must be some reason for building a home made clock. There was no reason to take him out of school in cuffs, suspend him from school, and take him to juvie. Look at his academic record. Talk to his engineering teacher. Does the kid of a history of causing problems, or a history of building things for fun?

    In the story it says one of the cops said, “He said an officer he’d never seen before leaned back in his chair and remarked: “Yup. That’s who I thought it was.”

    Why would he be suspended? He didn’t leave it anyplace. he didn’t act like it was a bomb or joke it was. I think if the parents pursue it, it could get expensive. They probably have a pretty good case.

  • #286404

    newmom
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    @EGL Admin 117369 wrote:

    In the story it says one of the cops said, “He said an officer he’d never seen before leaned back in his chair and remarked: “Yup. That’s who I thought it was.”

    Why would he be suspended? He didn’t leave it anyplace. he didn’t act like it was a bomb or joke it was. I think if the parents pursue it, it could get expensive. They probably have a pretty good case.

    I’m not sure that happened the way the boy says it did, so I’m reserving judgement on that statement. I don’t understand why the boy was suspended. It doesn’t make sense.

  • #286451

    violarose
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    What an interesting little fellow. I would love to hang out with his brilliancy . I hope he sees what a horribly funny society we have become. I can’t wait to see his science projects!

  • #286405

    newmom
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    I see my son building something cool with his cute little Snap Circuits and someone saying it’s something like a bomb.

  • #286317

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    It’s pretty bad that we have come to this point where something so simple and fun as building something cool with electronics is now something you have to worry about that your kid gets in trouble. This is what we have been talking about happening. It is the consequences of all the sue happy people. The schools are scared to death of something happening and being held liable so they overreact to everything. They can’t look at each case individually anymore. Everything has to be spelled out and this is what we get for that. It’s our own fault.

  • #286458

    ActionEmotion
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    I think when the facts come out you will learn that there was a great degree of deception involved in the making, presenting and eventual confiscation of this clock. Police claim that the “facts” stated by the boy and his father were not offered at the time the boy was confronted and that they were being non cooperative leading police to assume that something was amiss. I think that this father is at the root of this and is attempting to create a situation of victimization for whatever reason.

  • #286406

    newmom
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    @Action>Emotion 117379 wrote:

    I think when the facts come out you will learn that there was a great degree of deception involved in the making, presenting and eventual confiscation of this clock. Police claim that the “facts” stated by the boy and his father were not offered at the time the boy was confronted and that they were being non cooperative leading police to assume that something was amiss. I think that this father is at the root of this and is attempting to create a situation of victimization for whatever reason.

    Why do you say this? What evidence is there that there was deception about this clock at all?

  • #286318

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    @newmom 117384 wrote:

    Why do you say this? What evidence is there that there was deception about this clock at all?

    Possibly from the school and the cops?

  • #286359

    LC
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    O-M-G

    Now he’s been invited to the White House! That is absolutely insane. ANYTHING to pander to Muslims from this guy.

    Police comment from USA Today:
    Police Chief Larry Boyd said Wednesday the wires in a briefcase looked suspicious — and that Ahmed was not immediately “forthcoming” other than to say the device was a clock. He said the incident “evolved as it did as a matter of safety and an abundance of caution” and that no charges will be filed.

    Again, is public safety not the prime concern here? Did the police overreact? Maybe! But if the kid wasn’t forthcoming and you are looking at a briefcase with wires, and they know there’s a clock in there…..you make the call. SMHS

  • #286319

    EGL Admin
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    He’s being invited to Facebook too.

    Mark Zuckerberg:
    You’ve probably seen the story about Ahmed, the 14 year old student in Texas who built a clock and was arrested when he took it to school.

    Having the skill and ambition to build something cool should lead to applause, not arrest. The future belongs to people like Ahmed.

    Ahmed, if you ever want to come by Facebook, I’d love to meet you. Keep building.

  • #286320

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    @lc 117388 wrote:

    O-M-G

    Now he’s been invited to the White House! That is absolutely insane. ANYTHING to pander to Muslims from this guy.

    Police comment from USA Today:
    Police Chief Larry Boyd said Wednesday the wires in a briefcase looked suspicious — and that Ahmed was not immediately “forthcoming” other than to say the device was a clock. He said the incident “evolved as it did as a matter of safety and an abundance of caution” and that no charges will be filed.

    Again, is public safety not the prime concern here? Did the police overreact? Maybe! But if the kid wasn’t forthcoming and you are looking at a briefcase with wires, and they know there’s a clock in there…..you make the call. SMHS

    That’s Obama giving the finger to the cops again plain and simple.

  • #286407

    newmom
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    @lc 117388 wrote:

    O-M-G

    Now he’s been invited to the White House! That is absolutely insane. ANYTHING to pander to Muslims from this guy.

    Police comment from USA Today:
    Police Chief Larry Boyd said Wednesday the wires in a briefcase looked suspicious — and that Ahmed was not immediately “forthcoming” other than to say the device was a clock. He said the incident “evolved as it did as a matter of safety and an abundance of caution” and that no charges will be filed.

    Again, is public safety not the prime concern here? Did the police overreact? Maybe! But if the kid wasn’t forthcoming and you are looking at a briefcase with wires, and they know there’s a clock in there…..you make the call. SMHS

    Is it possible that the police idea of “forthcoming” is different than that of a teen? I ask my kids what they did in school today and I’m told “the usual” as if that explains it all. Is it possible he said “it’s a clock because I wanted to make a clock” and that wasn’t good enough? Or they asked what he intended to do with the clock and he said “nothing”?

  • #286408

    newmom
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    @EGL Admin 117385 wrote:

    Possibly from the school and the cops?

    I read nothing in any article that indicated any kind of deception, so that’s what I’m looking for. Where are you seeing deception?

  • #286472

    Anonymous
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    Obviously I don’t know all the facts and might be speculating..

    First, let me state that he probably is just a shy, introvert teenager. If the facts are correct, he was probably just quiet and not completely forthcoming to administration at the school. Since they didn’t have the facts, they had to expect the worse…
    But on the other hand, if this was a device that caused harm and the school did nothing there would be crowds of people criticizing them and saying “another stupid school not providing safety for their children.”

    It seems that the administration and police made a mistake. Given the information they had, they proceeded.

    Additionally, The pandering to this boy now is ridiculous. Obama does NOT need to comment about this.

    As someone asked earlier, if this was a white boy, would he have been suspended??? I can certainly say that if this was a white boy, Obama and Zuckerburg would’ve kept their mouths shut. Pathetic.

    Also, why is it that the sisters aren’t concerned about anything other than “trending at #1” on twitter.

    All other things aside, I do commend this young man for being creative and using his skills to create and build things.. Chances are he will do good things in life.

    I guess I am just annoyed by the “public outcry.” Without facts people cry racism. The constant sweeping accusations of racism does nothing positive for this country

  • #286473

    Anonymous
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    @newmom 117391 wrote:

    Is it possible that the police idea of “forthcoming” is different than that of a teen? I ask my kids what they did in school today and I’m told “the usual” as if that explains it all. Is it possible he said “it’s a clock because I wanted to make a clock” and that wasn’t good enough? Or they asked what he intended to do with the clock and he said “nothing”?

    The police’s idea of forthcoming is possibly different from this teens. But that doesn’t mean that he doesn’t have to communicate with them. If they are asking questions and he isn’t responding or giving one word answers, then they need to proceed differently.

  • #286409

    newmom
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    It’s possible though that his answer of “it’s just a clock, it isn’t going to be used for anything” wasn’t their idea of a complete answer.

  • #286360

    LC
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    Liberals are driving me batshit with this stuff. I turned on the TV to record the debate (I’ll miss it), and got to listen to Gavin Newsom on MSNBC calling Trump a racist. Not just a racist, but a “comb over racist.” Then he was calling the Republican Party racist, and blaming Pete Wilson. This from our Lt. Gov? And that’s OK since when? At least he has good taste in women.

    The hypocrisy and wildly different set of rules for different political beliefs is starting to get to me, and now its gnawing at me, and I’m pretty much a moderate. It’s easier to just turn off the noise, but i know it’s there. I called my wife and told her, and she agreed–told me to fire up the hunt again in Central Oregon. Part time for us, but better for my health, plus i just feel better up there and to me its still home.

    I can see why people that don’t have ties here (we do) are leaving the state for places like Texas and Utah where there’s some freedom of thought and expression remaining. Crap weather though!

  • #286410

    newmom
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    See, part of the problem is that every article contains different information. Every article I’ve read, including the one above, claims that clock was in a pencil case, not a briefcase. Would anyone’s opinion about the clock change based on whether it’s in a briefcase or a pencil case?

    Zuckerburg didn’t invite him because he’s Muslim. He invited him because he appears to be a talented kid who is interested in robotics, electronics, and other cool stuff and that should be nurtured, not harassed.
    Even if the school was trying to be cautious-which there is no problem with-does being cautious include a 3 day suspension, being taken out of school in cuffs, and sent to juvenile hall? You don’t think that’s excessive?

  • #286411

    newmom
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    This statement for the CNN article http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/16/us/texas-student-ahmed-muslim-clock-bomb/index.html

    Irving Police spokesman Officer James McLellan told the station, “We attempted to question the juvenile about what it was and he would simply only tell us that it was a clock.”The teenager did that because, well, it was a clock, he said.
    On Wednesday, police announced the teen will not be charged.
    Chief Larry Boyd said Ahmed should have been “forthcoming” by going beyond the description that what he made was a clock. But Boyd said authorities determined that the teenager did not intend to alarm anyone and the device, which the chief called “a homemade experiment,” was innocuous.

    Sounds like his saying “it’s a clock” wasn’t good enough.

  • #286361

    LC
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    I’d be careful about confusing news snippets for complete facts. Maybe the police action was excessive. Had you been there and had the benefit of all the interactions, you might still think so, or you might agree that it was appropriate. Juvenile hall is where minors typically go. Ask me how I know 😉

  • #286412

    newmom
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    I’m really aware of where juveniles go. Why did they have to take him away from school to clear it up at all though?
    You seem to be guilty of confusing news snippets for facts as well, LC, since you’ve chosen to believe the one article that claims the clock was in a briefcase rather than a pencil case, and that this kid wasn’t being forthcoming, when it appears he was as forthcoming as he could be since all he made was a clock.

  • #286452

    violarose
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    He is a kid. and omg, even my nicest girls will get all quiet if they feel overwhelmed by so many cops and principals. Kid is a genius, and we should try to find the positive side to help him. He might be a cure for something, we might need him in the future more than he needs us. I wish more kids worked on side projects, fascinating.

  • #286362

    LC
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    No, read back. I only know what I’ve read. That’s why I said what I did above.

    How do you know WHY Zuckerburg invited him? You don’t, nor do I. You’re making wild assumptions with some political bias. We all do that on occasion, and it’s good to watch it, I think.

  • #286413

    newmom
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    @lc 117404 wrote:

    No, read back. I only know what I’ve read. That’s why I said what I did above.

    How do you know WHY Zuckerburg invited him? You don’t, nor do I. You’re making wild assumptions with some political bias. We all do that on occasion, and it’s good to watch it, I think.

    The point if that different articles say different things. The article above states the clock was in a pencil pouch. You brought in an article that says a brief case. I’ve read 5 different articles today and only yours claims it’s brief case.

    As to how I why Zuckerburg invited him-I know what I read. This was his invitation-

    You’ve probably seen the story about Ahmed, the 14 year old student in Texas who built a clock and was arrested when he took it to school. Having the skill and ambition to build something cool should lead to applause, not arrest. The future belongs to people like Ahmed.
    Ahmed, if you ever want to come by Facebook, I’d love to meet you. Keep building.

    As for political bias? Really? Says the guy who claims that everyone is pandering to this kid because he’s Muslim? How do YOU know they are?
    I stated earlier I don’t know that the kid was mistreated because he’s Muslim. I also stated that I didn’t necessarily believe the statement the kid made that a police officer he’d never seen before said something along the lines of, “that’s who I thought it was.”

    Who is demonstrating political bias? Me because I don’t believe he wasn’t forthcoming to police, just because the police said he wasn’t? Me because I don’t think that a tech leader could see a reason to invite a kid who is probably like he was as a teen to his business?

  • #286363

    LC
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    If you are comfortable with your “facts” then there’s no reason for you to keep defending them.

  • #286414

    newmom
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    I’m not defending my information, I’m defending myself, because you are claiming that I am selectively choosing what to believe, and who to believe, so suit my political narrative…all while claiming that you know the real truth about the incident and the aftermath.

  • #286321

    EGL Admin
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    Does anyone know how big the clock is? A pencil pouch is pretty small. This one of those stories, where the truth is probably somewhere in the middle. It’s a he said/she said thing. I think the school did nothing wrong by being concerned. I don’t know the kid would be cuffed and taken to juvie. Couldn’t they figure it out at the school? Did they have reason to take him in?

  • #286455

    kindrlindr
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    My kids would do and DO this crap all the time from nothing.. They are “white.” No one notices. No one invites them to Facebook or Google or the white house. Maybe if they were a different “color” they would be? 😉 Maybe Logan should bring one of his inventions to school. I highly doubt anything would happen to him. They might call me, they might just take it from him until after school and send it home with him. But arrest him? No way.

    Something about this story sounds “odd” You don’t just go from a circuit board to arrest? WTH? What are we missing here?

  • #286486

    plasmadrive
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    OK.. looking at the size of the picture, comparing the circuit board and the readout the fact is that this is more likely some sort of little hobby or pencil case. It is not very big and definitely NOT a briefcase. News stories seldom seem to worry about facts..

    The “fact” that the kid said it is a clock and nothing more is about the end of it.. it was a clock and nothing more.. they wanted him to say it was something else I would believe.. and that is most likely their “not forthcoming” part

  • #286415

    newmom
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    @kindrlindr 117410 wrote:

    My kids would do and DO this crap all the time from nothing.. They are “white.” No one notices. No one invites them to Facebook or Google or the white house. Maybe if they were a different “color” they would be? 😉 Maybe Logan should bring one of his inventions to school. I highly doubt anything would happen to him. They might call me, they might just take it from him until after school and send it home with him. But arrest him? No way.

    Something about this story sounds “odd” You don’t just go from a circuit board to arrest? WTH? What are we missing here?

    Or maybe it’s because they were never taken from school in handcuffs and questioned by police for their inventions? Plus suspended?

  • #286487

    plasmadrive
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    Yeah.. why was he suspended for taking a clock to school.. I still don’t get that one..

  • #286474

    Anonymous
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    @newmom 117395 wrote:

    It’s possible though that his answer of “it’s just a clock, it isn’t going to be used for anything” wasn’t their idea of a complete answer.

    Possibly. If he just repeated, its a clock, its a clock. Well, it might have been, but if they asked follow up questions and he didn’t answer them, then he isn’t being completely helpful with the investigation.

    Police: “what’s your name..?”
    Me “Cjay”
    Police: “What are you doing here.”
    Me ” My name is CJay..”
    Police. What is your purpose here?”
    Me “My name is Cjay.”

    Yes, I am answering a question, but am I being helpful????

    Also, where is the clock part of his device? They never showed a picture with numbers or the time….

  • #286488

    plasmadrive
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    @CJay916 117434 wrote:

    Possibly. If he just repeated, its a clock, its a clock. Well, it might have been, but if they asked follow up questions and he didn’t answer them, then he isn’t being completely helpful with the investigation.

    Police: “what’s your name..?”
    Me “Cjay”
    Police: “What are you doing here.”
    Me ” My name is CJay..”
    Police. What is your purpose here?”
    Me “My name is Cjay.”

    Yes, I am answering a question, but am I being helpful????

    Also, where is the clock part of his device? They never showed a picture with numbers or the time….

    Actually they did show a picture.. and to be quite honest.. I think the tax payers are going to pay for this one big time.. There was nothing suspicious about that project. They just didn’t have the knowledge and didn’t get someone with the knowledge to verify… shame on them for that. They had staff that was not only aware of it, but knew what it was… they just didn’t ask I assume.

  • #286322

    EGL Admin
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    Here’s a photo of the clock. I don’t think it fits in a pencil case.

    AP_250782557912-582x462.jpg

  • #286416

    newmom
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    That is a pencil case. It’s not a pouch type one, or one that holds 3 pencils and an eraser though. My daughter’s art teacher recommended them for their art supplies and they are (or were, at the beginning of the school year) available for $5.00 at WalMart. She opted for a plastic zip lock baggie though because of already carrying all her books around everyday and since that case is hard, it doesn’t move or flex in a backpack. Look at the size of the thing next too the standard size plug. It’s not very large.

  • #286475

    Anonymous
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    @EGL Admin 117444 wrote:

    Here’s a photo of the clock. I don’t think it fits in a pencil case.

    AP_250782557912-582x462.jpg

    Oh, I saw that picture but didn’t realize the red part on top was the digital time part of the clock. I see it now.

    But lets be honest. If you saw this, regardless of who created it…. It looks suspicious.

    Does he deserve to be suspended.. Nope

    Does he deserve to be arrested.. Nope

    But we don’t know what actions, or lack of actions led to the arrest.

    I’ve said this earlier. Imagine there was a little explosive hidden somewhere in that case and it went off. EVERY finger would point at the school accusing them of not providing a safe school environment.
    You can’t win or lose in school administration.

    Can’t both sides just see that this was a misunderstanding and move on.. NOPE SUE that person, FIRE that person!!!

    But I also agree that this student is very creative and we shouldn’t stop him from being creative and should encourage it…

  • #286459

    ActionEmotion
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    @newmom 117384 wrote:

    Why do you say this? What evidence is there that there was deception about this clock at all?

    From the school and the cops.

  • #286323

    EGL Admin
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    @newmom 117446 wrote:

    That is a pencil case. It’s not a pouch type one, or one that holds 3 pencils and an eraser though. My daughter’s art teacher recommended them for their art supplies and they are (or were, at the beginning of the school year) available for $5.00 at WalMart. She opted for a plastic zip lock baggie though because of already carrying all her books around everyday and since that case is hard, it doesn’t move or flex in a backpack. Look at the size of the thing next too the standard size plug. It’s not very large.

    Then our definition of a “pencil case” is vastly different. This is much closer to a briefcase.

  • #286454

    Scarlet
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    My daughter has a couple of those pencil boxes for her high end color pencils –

  • #286446

    tomwaltman
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    If he wasn’t a terrorist before, he probably is now…

    People have been watching WAAAAAAAY too many movies. This kid is a pretty good electrical engineer. I hope like hell he gets a good job in this country, as that is the single best way to build a flag-waving American.

  • #286447

    tomwaltman
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    Here is the conversation the kid had with the cops…

    Cops: Why did you build a bomb and bring it to school?
    Kid: Um… It’s a clock.
    Cops: Okay, but why did you make a clock-shaped bomb and bring it to school?
    Kid: Um… It’s a clock.
    Cops: I see. But why did you make this bomb and bring it to school to kill all of the Christian kids?
    Kid: It’s… a… clock.
    Cops: That doesn’t explain why you built a bomb and brought it to school. Tell us why you built this bomb to kill us Americans, even though there is obviously no explosive element to the device at all.
    Kid: Because I built a clock.

    Cop to other cops: This kid is obviously hiding something because he can’t tell us that is really is a bomb designed to destroy Western Civilization. We need to arrest him and take his bomb down to the station as evidence. Do any of you remember why we didn’t have the bomb squad blow this thing up like we do with virtually EVERY explosive device we encounter?
    Other cops: Because it is a clock.
    Cop to other cops: I see. Handcuff the kid and get him out of here…

  • #286417

    newmom
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    Walmart. It’s even called a pencil box. These are more decorative than the ones at the beginning of the school year, but the same idea and size. And look at the dimensions. It’s no where near the size of a briefcase.

    http://www.walmart.com/ip/Vaultz-Locking-Pencil-Box-Available-in-Multiple-Colors/36124229

  • #286418

    newmom
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    @scarlet 117513 wrote:

    My daughter has a couple of those pencil boxes for her high end color pencils –

    My daughter’s art teacher suggested them to protect the colored pencils in their backpacks since they get carried around all day and shrink a lot when sharpened.

  • #286324

    EGL Admin
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    You can put a cat in the oven but that don’t make it a biscuit.

  • #286419

    newmom
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    It also isn’t a briefcase.

  • #286495

    AdamsMommy
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    Poor kid….I bet if his name was Johnny or Matthew they would have never accused him of making a bomb…(its sad how people pre judge)

  • #286489

    plasmadrive
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    @CJay916 117455 wrote:

    Oh, I saw that picture but didn’t realize the red part on top was the digital time part of the clock. I see it now.

    But lets be honest. If you saw this, regardless of who created it…. It looks suspicious.

    Does he deserve to be suspended.. Nope

    Does he deserve to be arrested.. Nope

    But we don’t know what actions, or lack of actions led to the arrest.

    I’ve said this earlier. Imagine there was a little explosive hidden somewhere in that case and it went off. EVERY finger would point at the school accusing them of not providing a safe school environment.
    You can’t win or lose in school administration.

    Can’t both sides just see that this was a misunderstanding and move on.. NOPE SUE that person, FIRE that person!!!

    But I also agree that this student is very creative and we shouldn’t stop him from being creative and should encourage it…

    1st off I have no more info than anyone else, but from what info I do have……

    When you start arresting people for any reason you better at least have a clue what you are doing or what it is you are arresting them for.. to begin with, that is more like a store bought clock that has been taken apart and put in a pencil case. The reason you didn’t know the red thing was the readout is because you no doubt have no clue about electronics, just like the cops and the teacher. (but I would bet the cops knew). They could have brought in one of the other teachers that had electronics, or science or physics backgrounds and it would have been all over in a hot minute.. but instead they hauled this kid off in cuffs because ignorance was apparently bliss for the cops. Why not bring in the first teacher he showed it to? He knew what it was apparently. That collection of parts in NOT suspicious in any way to even a 1st year electronics student. So many are afraid of what they don’t understand..

    Handcuffing for “his safety and ours” is also BS.

    I don’t even mind profiling because I think it could play a valuable roll in security of our country… but not taking 5 mins to find out some facts first in this case was just plain lazy and it seems to be very poor police work. This whole incident was more about the ignorance of the teacher that turned him in compounded by the ignorance and laziness of the cops that made no effort to find out what it was from someone at the school BEFORE they over reacted. They knew it wasn’t dangerous or the school would have been evacuated and they would not have carried it in the squad car.

    Now, from what I read he still got a 3 day suspension and no one apologized to him. This is why people sue….. This BTW, is what lawyers as a group have done to this country.

  • #286342

    adiffer
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    @Action>Emotion 117379 wrote:

    I think when the facts come out you will learn that there was a great degree of deception involved in the making, presenting and eventual confiscation of this clock. Police claim that the “facts” stated by the boy and his father were not offered at the time the boy was confronted and that they were being non cooperative leading police to assume that something was amiss. I think that this father is at the root of this and is attempting to create a situation of victimization for whatever reason.

    meh. Sounds more like what a group of embarrassed LEO’s would do to cover their asses. Basic CYA.

    The kid is obviously part of the maker crowd. How terribly spooky. 8)

  • #286325

    EGL Admin
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    @newmom 117522 wrote:

    It also isn’t a briefcase.

    Closer to a briefcase than a pencil box

  • #286326

    EGL Admin
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    @adamsmommy 117525 wrote:

    Poor kid….I bet if his name was Johnny or Matthew they would have never accused him of making a bomb…(its sad how people pre judge)

    True and he also wouldn’t have been invited to the white house either. Obama wouldn’t have even commented on the issue.

  • #286420

    newmom
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    @EGL Admin 117530 wrote:

    Closer to a briefcase than a pencil box

    Not with those dimensions. Did you look at them?

  • #286421

    newmom
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    @EGL Admin 117531 wrote:

    True and he also wouldn’t have been invited to the white house either. Obama wouldn’t have even commented on the issue.

    Better watch out. LC will say you don’t know what he was invited to the White House and point out your obvious political bias.

  • #286490

    plasmadrive
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    @EGL Admin 117530 wrote:

    Closer to a briefcase than a pencil box

    No Doc. not really.. not even close to briefcase size. I believe it is an artist’s pencil box. You could not put a single sheet of 8.5×11 paper in this box without folding it.

  • #286327

    EGL Admin
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    @newmom 117534 wrote:

    Not with those dimensions. Did you look at them?

    What were the dimensions?

  • #286364

    LC
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    Whether it’s a briefcase or a pencil box is irrelevant, no? Newmom says it’s a pencil box because she actually has one like it, so let’s assume it is–but it’s also fair to say it does look suspicious in those pics. Certainly warrants some inspection. Let’s also keep in mind that the cops were probably SROs, and not trained in visual discrimination between a clock and something more serious.

    And, Newmom, Doc’s absolutely correct, in my opinion, about the WH invite. That’s my opinion–not my fact. Adam’s Mommy may be correct in her opinion as well.

  • #286491

    plasmadrive
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    That stuff does not look suspicious in any way to even a 1st year electronics student. Only those that have no clue about electronics would have no clue about what that is… I guess my point is that they could easily have taken 5 mins and asked someone that knew.. like that 1st teacher he showed it to. As well, why would he show it to a technical teacher if he was pretending it was a bomb. There is just too much ignorance and laziness on the part of the police in this story to justify what they did.

    I am normally on the other side of these things.. but this time, they screwed up BIG TIME.. and won’t even admit it.

    As for the WH invite.. that is just BS.. no justification what so ever for that..

  • #286422

    newmom
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    @EGL Admin 117539 wrote:

    What were the dimensions?

    [h=3]Specifications[/h] [TABLE=”class: table table-striped-odd table-first-col-font-alt font-semibold”]
    [TR=”class: js-product-specs-row”]
    [TD]Battery Type:[/TD]
    [TD] Does Not Contain a Battery [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR=”class: js-product-specs-row”]
    [TD]Model No.:[/TD]
    [TD] VZ00393 [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR=”class: js-product-specs-row”]
    [TD]Shipping Weight (in pounds):[/TD]
    [TD] 1.0 [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR=”class: js-product-specs-row”]
    [TD]Product in Inches (L x W x H):[/TD]
    [TD] 8.25 x 2.5 x 5.5 [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR=”class: js-product-specs-row”]
    [TD]Walmart No.:[/TD]
    [TD] 552529758 [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

  • #286423

    newmom
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    @lc 117540 wrote:

    Whether it’s a briefcase or a pencil box is irrelevant, no? Newmom says it’s a pencil box because she actually has one like it, so let’s assume it is–but it’s also fair to say it does look suspicious in those pics. Certainly warrants some inspection. Let’s also keep in mind that the cops were probably SROs, and not trained in visual discrimination between a clock and something more serious.

    And, Newmom, Doc’s absolutely correct, in my opinion, about the WH invite. That’s my opinion–not my fact. Adam’s Mommy may be correct in her opinion as well.

    I know you agree with him, you said that same thing earlier. My point though is that when somebody-in this case me-pointed out a contrary opinion to Doc’s about why he was invited to Face Book HQ, you chimed in about being careful not to be biased. I think the two of you are just a biased, if not more so.

  • #286328

    EGL Admin
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    @newmom 117543 wrote:

    [h=3]Specifications[/h] [TABLE=”class: table table-striped-odd table-first-col-font-alt font-semibold”]
    [TR=”class: js-product-specs-row”]
    [TD]Battery Type:[/TD]
    [TD] Does Not Contain a Battery [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR=”class: js-product-specs-row”]
    [TD]Model No.:[/TD]
    [TD] VZ00393 [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR=”class: js-product-specs-row”]
    [TD]Shipping Weight (in pounds):[/TD]
    [TD] 1.0 [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR=”class: js-product-specs-row”]
    [TD]Product in Inches (L x W x H):[/TD]
    [TD] 8.25 x 2.5 x 5.5 [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR=”class: js-product-specs-row”]
    [TD]Walmart No.:[/TD]
    [TD] 552529758 [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

    I meant the dimensions of the kids box. His looks bigger than this one.

  • #286365

    LC
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    My post wasn’t intended to be personal, nor did I exclude myself (did i not use first person singular rather than second person?), or anyone else from the cautionary statement. I did point out something that had to be an assumption, and not a fact, as it was stated:

    I’d be careful about confusing news snippets for complete facts. Maybe the police action was excessive. Had you been there and had the benefit of all the interactions, you might still think so, or you might agree that it was appropriate. Juvenile hall is where minors typically go. Ask me how I know 😉

    And, to continue, I’m not nearly as convinced as many others that there’s not more to the story. Couple of things stand out to me:

    1. His father is a known political activist, according to at least one news story. Apple:Tree. We don’t know this to be the case with the son, of course, but it’s noteworthy.

    2. Didn’t the police say something like “that’s who I thought it was?” Something like that? Why did they know him? Had they had previous encounters or alerts? Assuming they were SROs, and unless it’s a really, really bad area (and Irving typically is not), they might have 10 schools under their patrol. SROs usually don’t know anyone except those with whom they have an encounter. If they weren’t SROs, then the liklihood of them knowing any particular student is even more unlikely.

    Here’s a FACT! We’ll never know, at least from the schools, because ed code prevents them from nearly any disclosure about student behavior, punishment, etc. In the case of a fight, parents always want to know “what punishment did the other kid get” and often the schools cannot respond. It’s very frustrating, but probably a good policy, and that’s why we know a LOT less about this and the background and history than certainly the media think they do.

  • #286329

    EGL Admin
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    @newmom 117544 wrote:

    I know you agree with him, you said that same thing earlier. My point though is that when somebody-in this case me-pointed out a contrary opinion to Doc’s about why he was invited to Face Book HQ, you chimed in about being careful not to be biased. I think the two of you are just a biased, if not more so.

    It’s an opinion based on the past actions. The President gets involved when the “victim” is not white. You have to be blind not to see that. The white girl in San Francisco is murdered by a multiple time deported POS. No comment at all. Some kid gets in trouble and immediately he comments on it? Kids in trouble everyday at school. I don’t think he should have been arrested. He should have been questioned. He shouldn’t be suspended unless there is some proof he did something wrong. There is a lot of speculation on what was said. That’s crazy since no one was there.

  • #286460

    ActionEmotion
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    @adiffer 117528 wrote:

    meh. Sounds more like what a group of embarrassed LEO’s would do to cover their asses. Basic CYA.

    The kid is obviously part of the maker crowd. How terribly spooky. 8)

    HA! Kid dismantled an old clock and put it back together, he didn’t make anything. The father is an activist, this whole thing is a set up and only liberals who see discrimination in everything haven’t figured this out yet.

  • #286366

    LC
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    @Action>Emotion 117548 wrote:

    HA! Kid dismantled an old clock and put it back together, he didn’t make anything. The father is an activist, this whole thing is a set up and only liberals who see discrimination in everything haven’t figured this out yet.

    Is that true, his dismantled an electronic clock and rebuilt it? I hadn’t seen that. I’m not sure it wasn’t a setup either, but I don’t think we can state that with any authority.

  • #286330

    EGL Admin
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    I see no reason to give Obama the benefit of the doubt. Everything he does is political.

  • #286331

    EGL Admin
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    @lc 117551 wrote:

    Is that true, his dismantled an electronic clock and rebuilt it? I hadn’t seen that. I’m not sure it wasn’t a setup either, but I don’t think we can state that with any authority.

    I don’t think I buy that it’s a set up. They didn’t know how the school would react.

  • #286367

    LC
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    @EGL Admin 117553 wrote:

    I don’t think I buy that it’s a set up. They didn’t know how the school would react.

    Ummmm….I dunno. I remember back in high school we used to park our cars on a dark street and loudly remove the hubcaps (yah–hubcabs), making sure they hit the pavement and made noise. About half the time the cops would eventually show up, pretty sure they had caught some thieves. We did it for sport, and to us it made the night when they came. Of course, we were just changing a tire. He’s a kid–maybe a little like us back then–I wouldn’t discount the possibility.

  • #286332

    EGL Admin
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    @lc 117555 wrote:

    Ummmm….I dunno. I remember back in high school we used to park our cars on a dark street and loudly remove the hubcaps (yah–hubcabs), making sure they hit the pavement and made noise. About half the time the cops would eventually show up, pretty sure they had caught some thieves. We did it for sport, and to us it made the night when they came. Of course, we were just changing a tire. He’s a kid–maybe a little like us back then–I wouldn’t discount the possibility.

    I think times are way different now. Kids don’t want to get in trouble now. Back in the day you would get a warning and that’s it. Punishment was subjective. Now there are guidelines for everything and mandatory suspensions. Not saying it’s impossible, but that’s really a stretch to think the kid or his dad planned it so this could happen. I think it’s a stretch to connect those dots. I think his ethnicity played a part in the whole thing. From him getting pulled aside to the invite to the white house and Facebook. I think when the cop said “that’s what I thought” it was because he saw the kid was a muslim and figured that’s he built the clock to be like a bomb or something. I don’t think a white kid gets pulled aside like that.

  • #286368

    LC
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    Here it is, from CNN:

    When Ahmed was called out of class, he said he was brought into a room with four police officers, one of whom said, “Yup. That’s who I thought it was.”
    Now, we don’t know what that means. I’m assuming they knew him, or about him, somehow. Your take is they saw a Middle Eastern kid and responded as they did.

  • #286333

    EGL Admin
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    @lc 117558 wrote:

    Here it is, from CNN:

    When Ahmed was called out of class, he said he was brought into a room with four police officers, one of whom said, “Yup. That’s who I thought it was.”
    Now, we don’t know what that means. I’m assuming they knew him, or about him, somehow. Your take is they saw a Middle Eastern kid and responded as they did.

    The kid said he had never seen the officer before so that’s why I said I think the officer made that comment because he saw the kid was middle eastern. It’s all speculation of course since neither the police or the school will comment on the kid’s history at school.
    I think that happens. Yesterday it was announced here in Elk Grove that 3 kids were arrested at Cosumnes Oaks for a residential burglary during school hours the previous morning. They didn’t say the race of the kids. Based on reading the crime reports every day, it seems like crimes involving kids, the suspects are most often black. That was my assumption of the race of the kids arrested and when I looked I was right.

  • #286424

    newmom
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    @lc 117546 wrote:

    My post wasn’t intended to be personal, nor did I exclude myself (did i not use first person singular rather than second person?), or anyone else from the cautionary statement. I did point out something that had to be an assumption, and not a fact, as it was stated:

    I’d be careful about confusing news snippets for complete facts. Maybe the police action was excessive. Had you been there and had the benefit of all the interactions, you might still think so, or you might agree that it was appropriate. Juvenile hall is where minors typically go. Ask me how I know 😉

    And, to continue, I’m not nearly as convinced as many others that there’s not more to the story. Couple of things stand out to me:

    1. His father is a known political activist, according to at least one news story. Apple:Tree. We don’t know this to be the case with the son, of course, but it’s noteworthy.

    2. Didn’t the police say something like “that’s who I thought it was?” Something like that? Why did they know him? Had they had previous encounters or alerts? Assuming they were SROs, and unless it’s a really, really bad area (and Irving typically is not), they might have 10 schools under their patrol. SROs usually don’t know anyone except those with whom they have an encounter. If they weren’t SROs, then the liklihood of them knowing any particular student is even more unlikely.

    Here’s a FACT! We’ll never know, at least from the schools, because ed code prevents them from nearly any disclosure about student behavior, punishment, etc. In the case of a fight, parents always want to know “what punishment did the other kid get” and often the schools cannot respond. It’s very frustrating, but probably a good policy, and that’s why we know a LOT less about this and the background and history than certainly the media think they do.

    The kid claims an officer he’s never seen said that, but I’m not sold that’s what was said. It’s very possible that given the intensity of the sitituation and the fear the kid had he misheard or misunderstood things that were said.

  • #286425

    newmom
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    @lc 117558 wrote:

    Here it is, from CNN:

    When Ahmed was called out of class, he said he was brought into a room with four police officers, one of whom said, “Yup. That’s who I thought it was.”
    Now, we don’t know what that means. I’m assuming they knew him, or about him, somehow. Your take is they saw a Middle Eastern kid and responded as they did.

    The article Doc posted said that the kid didn’t know the officer and had never seen him before. This is another example of selective reporting from the news agencies. Some report he didn’t know the officer, some don’t. Some call it a pencil box, others a brief case.
    From the article, posted :

    He said an officer he’d never seen before leaned back in his chair and remarked: “Yup. That’s who I thought it was.”

  • #286369

    LC
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    Slightly off topic, but when did pencil boxes begin to look like a folio? I’m sure if you recognize it as one, it is, I just haven’t seen one so large. Back in the dark ages, ours were wood, from Japan, and had an accordion style sliding top. They held 4-6 pencils and were pretty small. Maybe the kids are required to carry more now?

  • #286370

    LC
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    @EGL Admin 117559 wrote:

    Yesterday it was announced here in Elk Grove that 3 kids were arrested at Cosumnes Oaks for a residential burglary during school hours the previous morning. They didn’t say the race of the kids. Based on reading the crime reports every day, it seems like crimes involving kids, the suspects are most often black. That was my assumption of the race of the kids arrested and when I looked I was right.

    Certainly varies by area. Roseville has had a rash of home burglaries recently, and a couple of groups have been caught. Both were a mixture of males and females, all white, all looked pretty much what the kids look like in high school up here in the older areas, and both pictures showed their vehicles–lifted 4×4 pickups, LOL!

  • #286426

    newmom
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    @lc 117562 wrote:

    Slightly off topic, but when did pencil boxes begin to look like a folio? I’m sure if you recognize it as one, it is, I just haven’t seen one so large. Back in the dark ages, ours were wood, from Japan, and had an accordion style sliding top. They held 4-6 pencils and were pretty small. Maybe the kids are required to carry more now?

    I don’t know the answer to that one. I remember having small ones as a kid. Maybe when schools started requirung kids bring 4 different colored highlighters, a black pen, a blue pen, a red pen, special erasers, multiple pencils, etc.

  • #286334

    EGL Admin
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    @lc 117562 wrote:

    Slightly off topic, but when did pencil boxes begin to look like a folio? I’m sure if you recognize it as one, it is, I just haven’t seen one so large. Back in the dark ages, ours were wood, from Japan, and had an accordion style sliding top. They held 4-6 pencils and were pretty small. Maybe the kids are required to carry more now?

    My kids have pencil pouches and boxes. The boxes are about the size of the dimensions newmom posted. The photo I posted earlier looks larger than a pencil box

  • #286371

    LC
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    @EGL Admin 117531 wrote:

    True and he also wouldn’t have been invited to the white house either. Obama wouldn’t have even commented on the issue.

    Really, think so? Got some examples to back that up?

    If not, now you do. Bunch of ’em.

  • #286335

    EGL Admin
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    This President has proven he is not the President of the whole United States. He’s the President of non white people. Kids are suspended all the time for doing much less. On Facebook one of my FB friends commented on an article about this kid and asked why is the president even getting involved and two people commented that she was a racist for saying that. All she asked is why is he involved in this. Wow, when that is the basis for accusing someone of racism we have reached a bad time.

  • #286372

    LC
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    Largely thanks to Obama,too.

    If you are a straight white married middle income couple, you don’t even factor in Obamaworld. If you happen to be Christian or successful on top of that, you have a pall on you from the WH.

  • #286456

    kindrlindr
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    Do anyone actually WANT to factor in Obamaworld? How is that a trophy?

  • #286373

    LC
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    @kindrlindr 117570 wrote:

    Do anyone actually WANT to factor in Obamaworld? How is that a trophy?

    Not a trophy, but a reasonable request to be considered as our president, no? Obama in no way represents me, be it in priorities, values, ethics, well being, needs and wants, societal harmony, economics and spending, job creation, defense and foreign policy, middle class hand up, not hand outs, encouragement, or pride in America. Lots of us are just the wrong demographic to interest him, and fortunately, we seem to do fine in spite of him. I think that alone makes him put the hate on us.

  • #286343

    adiffer
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    @Action>Emotion 117548 wrote:

    HA! Kid dismantled an old clock and put it back together, he didn’t make anything. The father is an activist, this whole thing is a set up and only liberals who see discrimination in everything haven’t figured this out yet.

    As our ‘social T-cell’, what are you trying to point out?

    As for ‘not making anything’, you should get in touch with how young makers are educated.
    Taking something apart and putting it back together in a different place/way isn’t that far off from where I started.
    In my case it was my parent’s $150 short-wave radio in the mid-70’s.

  • #286427

    newmom
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    @lc 117566 wrote:

    Really, think so? Got some examples to back that up?

    If not, now you do. Bunch of ’em.

    There isn’t even a comparison between the incidents in the article and what happened to this kid. Was what happened those other kids stupid? Yes, no doubt about it. And what happened to this kid could have stopped at stupid, too….except that then the school got the police involved and it escalated to another level of stupidity all together, including handcuffs for a kid the size of a twig, and juvenile hall.
    Isn’t it possible that the invite was made not because the kid is Muslim, but rather to jump on the bandwagon of support for an intelligent and inventive kid who was treated poorly by the very people who should recognize his abilities-(his school and teachers)-regardless of what his religion is? I don’t care what the kids religion is, and I’m still not sure his religion had anything to do with what happened to him, but that doesn’t change that I believe what happened to him was heavy handed, stupid, and unnecessary. The school could have and should have handled this on its own. Getting the police involved was a huge overreaction. Does the school have a rule for bringing toy guns to school? I bet it does, and it might include suspension. The school didn’t need the police involved to know this kid was no threat to anyone. Suspend him for breaking the rules and bringing a pretend weapon to school and that’s the end of it.

  • #286374

    LC
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    Is it possible…sure. Some of us are just skeptical. That’s where opinions come in. Same with being heavy handed–seems like it, doesn’t it–but again we don’t know the history, if any. The school HAD to call the police because the”clock” looked suspicious to them. They’re not experts and given the externals today, they had to do a CYA and quick.

  • #286457

    kindrlindr
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    “Taking something apart and putting it back together in a different place/way isn’t that far off from where I started.
    In my case it was my parent’s $150 short-wave radio in the mid-70’s.”

    Yep. My son just took apart the iHome clock radio because it wasn’t working properly. He reinvented it (Kinda could pass for a homemade bomb if you ask me) and now it works…….without fitting back into the “case” mind you, so I am not going to use it, but kudos to him. 😉

  • #286344

    adiffer
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    heh. The project isn’t done until it fits back in a case. Remind him people pay for how it looks and he could buy all the toys he wants with the money he makes from making the thing work AND look good. 8)

  • #286476

    Anonymous
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    @plasmadrive 117526 wrote:

    1st off I have no more info than anyone else, but from what info I do have……

    The reason you didn’t know the red thing was the readout is because you no doubt have no clue about electronics, just like the cops and the teacher. (but I would bet the cops knew). They could have brought in one of the other teachers that had electronics, or science or physics backgrounds and it would have been all over in a hot minute..

    Assumptions much?

    Because homemade bombs never have wires or a timer..?

  • #286461

    ActionEmotion
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    Look, you guys can speculate all you want about Islamophobia, injustice, poor smart kid gets treated badly, and all that orchestrated garbage. I’m holding to common sense here. Boys father is a liberal Islamic activist. Kid dismantles 1970’s clock and places the parts in a briefcase which is highly suspicious looking.

    (Allow me to define suspicious: If a boy eating a pop tart into the shape of a gun gets expelled for a threatening gesture, then this certainly qualifies as suspicious since it looks like it could be a bomb. Don’t think so? Then I question your intellectual integrity.)

    Not one day later kid and parents invited to White House. Are you shitting me? This is so blatantly the work of political activism designed to create a victim (and remember, victims are heroes!) and then trot out the Homophobic, Racist, Islamophobia card because it fits within the lefts agenda to demonize America and Americans.

  • #286428

    newmom
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    1. Its NOT a briefcase. It’s a pencil box. We’ve provided links to the same brand of pencil boxes, and the article Doc link to describes it as:
    He said he threw it together in about 20 minutes before bedtime on Sunday: a circuit board and power supply wired to a digital display, all strapped inside a case with a tiger hologram on the front.
    Given the links provided about the pencil case, dimensions of the case (no where NEAR the size of a brief case), and the description of the tiger hologram on the front, are you really going to keep saying it’s a briefcase? If so, then I question your intellectual integrity.

    Where is your proof that the boy’s father is a “radical Islamic activist”? The only places I’ve seen that claim are here, from both you and LC. Neither of you have posted a source, but frankly, if it’s the same source that calls a PENCIL BOX a briefcase, than the source is clearly mistaken.

  • #286448

    tomwaltman
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    As a Chemical Officer in the United States Army (we blow things up regularly), I can say with authority that the device did not look anything like a bomb. It has some superficial resemblance to a movie “explosive” timing device, but most “bombs” require an explosive component that this device completely lacked. To make a bomb, you need something that goes BOOM.

    The kid created something that could be used as a timer. but there are FAR simpler ways to initiate an explosive device that don’t require much of what he used. You could use an electric timer/thermometer like you would use on a smoker, with very little “conversion.” LC, are you thinking of becoming a terrorist. I know you own at least one of those things. I own 2, but I use them to cook with myself…

  • #286375

    LC
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    Tom, you’re an expert. You’re no doubt right about the appearance. There was no indication the school folks, possibly even the responding cops, had your depth of knowledge and experience. Apparently Bill Maher didn’t either–

  • #286376

    LC
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    @newmom 117592 wrote:

    Where is your proof that the boy’s father is a “radical Islamic activist”? The only places I’ve seen that claim are here, from both you and LC. Neither of you have posted a source, but frankly, if it’s the same source that calls a PENCIL BOX a briefcase, than the source is clearly mistaken.

    Please find and re-post where I referred to his father as a “radical Islamic activist?” Don’t worry–you won’t–because I didn’t and you’re putting words in my mouth.

    I did refer to his father as a activist, political activist, I believe. I did not use the word “radical”. I’m surprised you missed that reference though–it was in many of the initial articles–at least the statement that he has run for President of Sudan. Here’s an additional reference from the Washington Post, in 2011:

    Elhassan, a native of the Sudan who is now an American citizen, likes to call himself a sheik. He wears a cleric’s flowing white robes and claims hundreds of followers throughout Egypt, Sudan and in the United States.
    But he is unknown as a scholar or holy man in the state he has called home for two decades. Religious leaders in Texas say they have never heard of Elhassan, including the imam at the mosque where he worships.
    “This so-called leader, we have never heard of this person,” said Imam Zia ul Haque Sheikh, the head of the Islamic Center of Irving. “I believe the whole thing is made up.”
    Elhassan has only a handful of followers who chant with him on Saturdays and Sundays at a small prayer center, located in a strip mall, that he founded in 2001 for other Sufi Muslims — a sect that embraces mysticism and a personal relationship with God.

    As to his running for office in Sudan, will this be OK as a reference?In 2010, and again this year, the busy dad was nominated and ran for president of his native North African country from his home in Texas. Or this?

    Awaiting your retraction of what I’ve posted, and your comment on the validity of the references, thank you.

  • #286462

    ActionEmotion
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    @newmom 117592 wrote:

    1. Its NOT a briefcase. It’s a pencil box. We’ve provided links to the same brand of pencil boxes, and the article Doc link to describes it as:
    He said he threw it together in about 20 minutes before bedtime on Sunday: a circuit board and power supply wired to a digital display, all strapped inside a case with a tiger hologram on the front.
    Given the links provided about the pencil case, dimensions of the case (no where NEAR the size of a brief case), and the description of the tiger hologram on the front, are you really going to keep saying it’s a briefcase? If so, then I question your intellectual integrity.

    Where is your proof that the boy’s father is a “radical Islamic activist”? The only places I’ve seen that claim are here, from both you and LC. Neither of you have posted a source, but frankly, if it’s the same source that calls a PENCIL BOX a briefcase, than the source is clearly mistaken.

    LOL, OK pencil box. Who cares what it is called, it’s the appearance that matters. I don’t care if it were a shoe box, the fact of the matter is that this thing looked suspicious and in my opinion was made to look suspicious in order for this whole charade to work. He got no negative reaction from his teachers in several classes until the alarm went off in English class and the teacher saw the PENCIL BOX with wires attached to it’s clasp and it was beeping. That’s when things went into motion. Little Mohammed said he put the wires around the clasp to “make it look less suspicious”. OH so he knew it would be looked upon as suspicious, why all the shock?

    This is such blatant manipulation of media for the purposes of bringing up a false Islamophobia claim. I am amazed some of you are actually falling for it.

  • #286463

    ActionEmotion
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    @tomwaltman 117593 wrote:

    As a Chemical Officer in the United States Army (we blow things up regularly), I can say with authority that the device did not look anything like a bomb. It has some superficial resemblance to a movie “explosive” timing device, but most “bombs” require an explosive component that this device completely lacked. To make a bomb, you need something that goes BOOM.

    The kid created something that could be used as a timer. but there are FAR simpler ways to initiate an explosive device that don’t require much of what he used. You could use an electric timer/thermometer like you would use on a smoker, with very little “conversion.” LC, are you thinking of becoming a terrorist. I know you own at least one of those things. I own 2, but I use them to cook with myself…

    Do you try to be clueless Tom or is it part of your training. Yes, bombs need an explosive but what English teacher on quick glance is going to decide if the closed PENCIL BOX with wires coming from it and beeping had explosives in it? On the other hand, in the case of the kid with the pop tart, you think pop tart terrorist kid posed a threat? How about the kid who pointed a finger and said bang bang who was suspended for a “Level two look-alike firearm”. Was he a danger? These kids weren’t invited to the White House were they? They weren’t suffering from being oppressed by some sort of imaginary racism, no, these kids were just punished for breaking the rules by appearing to have something related to weaponry with them or in the latter case, a part of his body.

    Grasp the reality will you. This is a set up, you have been duped. No victims to make into heroes here, move on.

  • #286449

    tomwaltman
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    Wow, you guys are so totally caught up in the political crap now that you lose sight of the fact that this is media driven garbage. The kid made a clock. An ENGLISH teacher reported it. The cops had it open, and STILL decided to arrest the kid. The science teacher already saw it and patted the kid on the head. If this is some kind of plot by the kid’s radical Islamist father, he chose the most idiotic approach, and I wouldn’t think too highly of his terrorist skills. You guys are going WAY over the edge on this one. WAAAAY over the edge.

    And if this was some kind of plot to what, embarrass the police, the school, wackos who want to obsess over whether something is right wing or left wing, then it succeeded more that anyone could have hoped. Because I would be embarrassed if I put that much mental energy into this silliness.

    If any of you would like to make a detonator, let em know. I can show you a few ways that don’t require pencil boxes and circuit boards.

  • #286377

    LC
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    @Action>Emotion 117598 wrote:

    Grasp the reality will you. This is a set up, you have been duped. No victims to make into heroes here, move on.

    Tom has been a super-dupee for awhile now, but with that said, the fact remains that no matter how many facts you try to make up, how many assumptions or opinions we choose to confuse as facts, or even by misquoting someone or some source to try to make your point, we are only proving we know very little about this case, so all our “I’m the expert” and “I got the answer” posts filter down to merely guesses.

    It’s probably fair to say that Obama’s White House invite, the FB visit, etc. were politically motivated, first and foremost. It’s equally fair to suspect that had the boy not been of Middle East descent, and had his father not had some history, which may be why the cops knew of Ahmed, he might not have been jumped on as he was.

    Was this a set-up, engineered by the boy, the boy and his father, or maybe even others? I could never make the statement to the affirmative, but I would not bet against it.

  • #286450

    tomwaltman
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    It is all speculation, including my own statements, as none of us know what really happened there.

    That said, I am merely applying your Occam’s Razor to this stupidity. Don’t look at me to solve your riddles. You guys are doing this all on your own…

  • #286378

    LC
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    @tomwaltman 117601 wrote:

    It is all speculation, including my own statements, as none of us know what really happened there.

    That said, I am merely applying your Occam’s Razor to this stupidity. Don’t look at me to solve your riddles. You guys are doing this all on your own…

    In this case, I think there are numerous violations of Occam, simply because some are trying to discard bits of information that may be integral to the topic, while injecting assumptions or talking points that are extraneous.

  • #286429

    newmom
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    @Action>Emotion 117597 wrote:

    LOL, OK pencil box. Who cares what it is called, it’s the appearance that matters. I don’t care if it were a shoe box, the fact of the matter is that this thing looked suspicious and in my opinion was made to look suspicious in order for this whole charade to work. He got no negative reaction from his teachers in several classes until the alarm went off in English class and the teacher saw the PENCIL BOX with wires attached to it’s clasp and it was beeping. That’s when things went into motion. Little Mohammed said he put the wires around the clasp to “make it look less suspicious”. OH so he knew it would be looked upon as suspicious, why all the shock?

    This is such blatant manipulation of media for the purposes of bringing up a false Islamophobia claim. I am amazed some of you are actually falling for it.

    Please look back. I said several times I don’t know if his being Muslim has anything to do with the situation-so take that out of this equation, because I never said that.

  • #286430

    newmom
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    @lc 117596 wrote:

    Please find and re-post where I referred to his father as a “radical Islamic activist?” Don’t worry–you won’t–because I didn’t and you’re putting words in my mouth.

    I did refer to his father as a activist, political activist, I believe. I did not use the word “radical”. I’m surprised you missed that reference though–it was in many of the initial articles–at least the statement that he has run for President of Sudan. Here’s an additional reference from the Washington Post, in 2011:

    Elhassan, a native of the Sudan who is now an American citizen, likes to call himself a sheik. He wears a cleric’s flowing white robes and claims hundreds of followers throughout Egypt, Sudan and in the United States.
    But he is unknown as a scholar or holy man in the state he has called home for two decades. Religious leaders in Texas say they have never heard of Elhassan, including the imam at the mosque where he worships.
    “This so-called leader, we have never heard of this person,” said Imam Zia ul Haque Sheikh, the head of the Islamic Center of Irving. “I believe the whole thing is made up.”
    Elhassan has only a handful of followers who chant with him on Saturdays and Sundays at a small prayer center, located in a strip mall, that he founded in 2001 for other Sufi Muslims — a sect that embraces mysticism and a personal relationship with God.

    As to his running for office in Sudan, will this be OK as a reference?In 2010, and again this year, the busy dad was nominated and ran for president of his native North African country from his home in Texas. Or this?

    Awaiting your retraction of what I’ve posted, and your comment on the validity of the references, thank you.

    You are correct that you only called him a “known political activist”-and there where no negative connotation there, where there? A>E called him a radical. As for running for president of Sudan (while in the US)-did every person that ran for the gov. of CA when Davis was recalled get called a “political activist by you too? Because it seems he has as much support as that porn star that ran for governor, since the people quoted in the story say they’ve never even heard of him and claim he is unknown. How influential and active can he really be if no one has heard of him or looks to him for guidance? Even the local Islamic center has NEVER heard of him. So how active is he?

  • #286379

    LC
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    Some people find it’s better to simply acknowledge an error than to try to justify it. But, I appreciate your response, Newmom.

  • #286345

    adiffer
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    @CJay916 117585 wrote:

    Assumptions much?

    Because homemade bombs never have wires or a timer..?

    Heh. They’ve usually got a lump of something solid or plastic that goes boom. (edit: Tom says it better.)
    For stuff wired up by a kid, the explosives are likely to be crude unless a parent is an actual bomb maker.

    Things I made as a kid would get FBI attention nowadays, but the non-clock part was pretty obvious. 8)

  • #286346

    adiffer
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    @Action>Emotion 117591 wrote:

    (Allow me to define suspicious: If a boy eating a pop tart into the shape of a gun gets expelled for a threatening gesture, then this certainly qualifies as suspicious since it looks like it could be a bomb. Don’t think so? Then I question your intellectual integrity.)[/quote]

    Come now. If you aren’t completely embarrassed by the pop tart thing I question your sense of humor.

    When I was a kid testing the limits of my mother’s willingness to apply discipline, I found that she was willing to enforce her rule AND see the humor in what I did. I was annoying her one day by poking my nose into everything including her manual sewing machine. A kid can be injured by one of those in a way that is difficult to stop without continuing the machine’s motion forward stitching the kid’s finger to whatever else is in there. She told me ‘If you so much as touch the sewing machine…’ I forget the exact punishment she threatened, but I walked up to it and barely touched it on the safest part. I obviously got her message, but challenged her authority. Of course, she punished me, but she said in later years she had to work hard not to bust up.

    What was the pop tart thing if not something similar?

    Quote:
    Not one day later kid and parents invited to White House. Are you shitting me? This is so blatantly the work of political activism designed to create a victim (and remember, victims are heroes!) and then trot out the Homophobic, Racist, Islamophobia card because it fits within the lefts agenda to demonize America and Americans.

    You are missing the incredibly obvious.
    Obama was embarrassed this happened to a smart kid.
    He took what action he could.

  • #286431

    newmom
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    @lc 117605 wrote:

    Some people find it’s better to simply acknowledge an error than to try to justify it. But, I appreciate your response, Newmom.

    The point is I don’t think he qualifies as a political activist either, does he?

  • #286380

    LC
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    @newmom 117609 wrote:

    The point is I don’t think he qualifies as a political activist either, does he?

    Nah. I know a lot of people who’ve run for the president of a Muslim country twice, have a cult church that embraces mysticism in a strip mall, are vice-president of the Reform Party in Sudan, and claimed to be the defense attorney for the Koran in the Rev. Jones case.

    You don’t consider that pattern political activism?

  • #286432

    newmom
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    But no one locally even knows who he is! How influential can he be??? And he barely has ANY followers, according to your article. He claims several hundred in an area of the world with millions of people, but his own community, even at the mosque where he worships, has never heard of him. He has a “handful of followers” locally. I can rent a space in a strip mall and call myself a mystic too, but that doesn’t make me an activist, influential, or important in the community. As Doc said, you can put a cat in the oven but that don’t make it a biscuit.

    This is the article you posted-
    Elhassan, a native of the Sudan who is now an American citizen, likes to call himself a sheik. He wears a cleric’s flowing white robes and claims hundreds of followers throughout Egypt, Sudan and in the United States.But he is unknown as a scholar or holy man in the state he has called home for two decades. Religious leaders in Texas say they have never heard of Elhassan, including the imam at the mosque where he worships.
    “This so-called leader, we have never heard of this person,” said Imam Zia ul Haque Sheikh, the head of the Islamic Center of Irving. “I believe the whole thing is made up.”
    Elhassan has only a handful of followers who chant with him on Saturdays and Sundays at a small prayer center, located in a strip mall, that he founded in 2001 for other Sufi Muslims — a sect that embraces mysticism and a personal relationship with God.

  • #286381

    LC
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    I’d guess that few would argue that anyone who has run for president of a nation twice, and is a vice-president of a political party, no matter how small, would be aptly called a political activist.

    There are now several so-called experts that have stated the clock was a fraud, most likely made by Radio Shack, and simply transferred from one container to another. You should feel free to Google it. You’ll find plenty of YouTubes, some from questionable sources, a few fairly legit. Several dissect the events carefully, showing several inconsistencies between his story and his actions.

    He has two funds now according to Fox, one for a scholarship, the other for legal defense as his non-activist father is suing the school and I believe the police. Shock. IF he proceeds, their defense attorneys will of course go through discovery, so we’ll see if it’s true, all or part. Maybe the media will once again quote Obama telling him “you didn’t build this.” My guess is not much will happen, because “mission accomplished.” What remains the question, is what exactly that mission was? Money? Publicity? Or, worst case, a test.

  • #286464

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    @adiffer 117607 wrote:

    Come now. If you aren’t completely embarrassed by the pop tart thing I question your sense of humor.

    Sorry, I missed your point. The kid who was expelled for eating a pop tart http://s1.legalinsurrection.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Pop-Tart-Gun.jpginto the vague shape which the teacher said resembled a gun was a real event that took place in this nation because of the stupid zero tolerance policies. The same for a second grade boy who was playing a hero save the world game from his imagination and threw a piece of crumbled up paper into the trash pretending it was a grenade. He was suspended too. How about the boy who said bang bang and was detained and expelled for producing a “Level 2 look alike firearm”.? With this mindset rampant in the school system how is ANYONE surprised, offended, convinced there is racial prejudice when something resembling a bomb starts beeping in class? If you don’t see this then you have blinders on.

  • #286433

    newmom
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    @lc 117615 wrote:

    I’d guess that few would argue that anyone who has run for president of a nation twice, and is a vice-president of a political party, no matter how small, would be aptly called a political activist.

    There are now several so-called experts that have stated the clock was a fraud, most likely made by Radio Shack, and simply transferred from one container to another. You should feel free to Google it. You’ll find plenty of YouTubes, some from questionable sources, a few fairly legit. Several dissect the events carefully, showing several inconsistencies between his story and his actions.

    He has two funds now according to Fox, one for a scholarship, the other for legal defense as his non-activist father is suing the school and I believe the police. Shock. IF he proceeds, their defense attorneys will of course go through discovery, so we’ll see if it’s true, all or part. Maybe the media will once again quote Obama telling him “you didn’t build this.” My guess is not much will happen, because “mission accomplished.” What remains the question, is what exactly that mission was? Money? Publicity? Or, worst case, a test.

    Well, I go back to how many people in his actual community know him. From your article, it sounds like no one does. He is a non entity in his religious and cultural circles.

  • #286382

    LC
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    We have political activists in our neighborhood, as do you in Elk Grove, that you’ve likely never heard of. Can you list all the local Islamic activists? Of course you can’t. Knowing a name does not define activism. I’ll leave you to thrash in the weeds on this one, and we’ll see how it all plays out.

  • #286347

    adiffer
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    @Action>Emotion 117616 wrote:

    Sorry, I missed your point. The kid who was expelled for eating a pop tart http://s1.legalinsurrection.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Pop-Tart-Gun.jpginto the vague shape which the teacher said resembled a gun was a real event that took place in this nation because of the stupid zero tolerance policies. The same for a second grade boy who was playing a hero save the world game from his imagination and threw a piece of crumbled up paper into the trash pretending it was a grenade. He was suspended too. How about the boy who said bang bang and was detained and expelled for producing a “Level 2 look alike firearm”.? With this mindset rampant in the school system how is ANYONE surprised, offended, convinced there is racial prejudice when something resembling a bomb starts beeping in class? If you don’t see this then you have blinders on.

    I CAN see it. I’m quite embarrassed that some of us are so stupid that we think such policies are a good idea. I’m highly amused (in that painful, laughing kind of way) when kids point out our stupidity.

    I think Obama gets it. I’m sure this kid does… now.

  • #286434

    newmom
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    @lc 117619 wrote:

    We have political activists in our neighborhood, as do you in Elk Grove, that you’ve likely never heard of. Can you list all the local Islamic activists? Of course you can’t. Knowing a name does not define activism. I’ll leave you to thrash in the weeds on this one, and we’ll see how it all plays out.

    “Thrash in the weeds”? Lol. Would political leaders in Elk Grove know the names of the activists though? I wouldn’t expect too, since I’m not politically active. But if people in his religious community-which you guys are claiming is a central piece of the story here-don’t know of him, how active can he be? Wouldn’t the actual leaders be aware of him?

  • #286465

    ActionEmotion
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    @adiffer 117623 wrote:

    I think Obama gets it. I’m sure this kid does… now.

    Obama gets nothing but his agenda.

  • #286383

    LC
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    How can anyone think Obama invited the lad with the clock he didn’t build to the White House for ANYTHING other than an “in your face” political move? Kids his age do brilliant things every day. What sets Ahmed apart from them, the non-invitees, other than in his case he apparently successfully duped the president, FB, and NASA in their rush for PC? For THAT, he gets full credit.

  • #286435

    newmom
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    How about being hauled out of class, questioned by police, then taken out of school in cuffs in front of all your classmates, then taken to juvie?
    That seems to be the different between this case and the others cited.

  • #286384

    LC
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    I think Bill Maher and Cuban may have the answer to your question (note this was before it was discovered the clock was probably not something he built). This is the unedited panel discussion–not just the funny parts from Maher.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGit-XltUB4

    Chris Matthews???? nails it at about 5:15. This is an excellent discussion on this. Surprised more hasn’t been quoted elsewhere. Actually, no, I’m not surprised at all.

  • #286348

    adiffer
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    Of course it was ‘in your face.’ What’s wrong with that? If he feels someone did something embarrassingly stupid, why shouldn’t he?

  • #286349

    adiffer
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    @Action>Emotion 117632 wrote:

    Obama gets nothing but his agenda.

    You are guilty of dehumanizing him.
    I’m not impressed.

  • #286385

    LC
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    Al, I think you interpreted Matthews comments in a different way that was intended. For once he was solid in saying we rush to judgment (including Obama) without knowing the background and facts.

    Unless you were talking about Obama. I don’t think a comment there would be additive.

    I think we’re going to soon learn it was in fact a hoax, but that’s my opinion only. I highly doubt Ahmed will ever see the inside of the White House.

  • #286350

    adiffer
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    @lc: Sorry. I was referring to Obama. I should have referenced your post.

    There is always the possibility that something will be found out later that had it been known earlier would have changed Obama’s response. He’s as human as any of us, though, so I suspect he was embarrassed (as were MANY people) and did what he could to remedy the situation.

    No one is perfect.
    No one has perfect knowledge.

    I’m moving on.

  • #286436

    newmom
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    Hoax or no hoax, the police response to the situation was unnecessary and that’s my problem with the entire thing. It was never a bomb, the first teacher he showed it to could have backed up that it wasn’t a bomb. As I said earlier, give him whatever consequences there are for bringing a toy or replica weapon to school and send him on his way. The handcuffs and juvenile hall were over the top.

  • #286477

    Anonymous
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    Whether you agree or don’t agree with how the police and administration handled the situation, can we acknowledge that bringing something that looks like a bomb to a school in the current climate of our country is stupid? There are school shooting and more school violence than usual. But someone brings in a “look-a-like” bomb and we criticize the school and police??

    I think creating a hoax bomb (whether it was his intent or not) should come with a higher consequence than a pop tart gun or a piece of paper cut out to look like a gun.

    What if he “left” it in the classroom and someone else found it. Would that be a different situation? What if he put clay or another substance to look like C-4?

    I mentioned before that this stupid is probably a really smart stupid that made a mistake. But can we admit it was a really stupid mistake. And even mistakes have consequences sometimes…

  • #286386

    LC
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    CJ, I don’t think some people understand how the schools must react to any situation like this. Whether the police overreacted or not is beyond my scope of knowledge, as we don’t know all the details, but the school did what was prudent and expected in a zero tolerance environment.

    I won’t acknowledge that it was stupid, as I believe it was a fully planned scenario, why I don’t know. It looks like he’s on his way to the White House, after a first stop at Google. Looks like even with some evidence that it was a fraud, the kid is pulling it off. I imagine that walking back isn’t to the benefit of anyone who has fallen all over themselves with the fake/misplaced outrage, as the alleged fraud hasn’t made the MSM and likely never will. A classic case of PC gone wrong in my estimation, but that’s the world we live in.

  • #286437

    newmom
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    @CJay916 117650 wrote:

    Whether you agree or don’t agree with how the police and administration handled the situation, can we acknowledge that bringing something that looks like a bomb to a school in the current climate of our country is stupid? There are school shooting and more school violence than usual. But someone brings in a “look-a-like” bomb and we criticize the school and police??

    I think creating a hoax bomb (whether it was his intent or not) should come with a higher consequence than a pop tart gun or a piece of paper cut out to look like a gun.

    What if he “left” it in the classroom and someone else found it. Would that be a different situation? What if he put clay or another substance to look like C-4?

    I mentioned before that this stupid is probably a really smart stupid that made a mistake. But can we admit it was a really stupid mistake. And even mistakes have consequences sometimes…

    To say the consequences for this should be greater that eating a pop tart into some ink blot shape of a gun implies there should be consequences for the pop tart situation, which is stupid by itself. The consequences for THIS should be the same as whatever the consequences are for bringing a fake gun or other weapon to school. Was it stupid to bring the clock to school-yes. No one is saying the kid shouldn’t face the consequences.

    I don’t think it took the police, handcuffs, and juvie to see this was a harmless electronic device. He wasn’t taken down away in handcuffs or to juvie because the school believed he had an actual bomb or was dangerous-if that were the case, the school would have been evacuated and the bomb squad would have been called. While you all keep defending the school’s actions, lets remember that none of that happened. None. School went on, and he was questioned at school for some amount of time before he was taken away in handcuffs. That doesn’t sound like they thought he was an actual danger to anyone.

    The school knew there was never a real THREAT or any danger. Everything the police did was because they wanted to believe he had some kind of dangerous reason for doing what he did. The situation should have ended with whatever the school consequences are for his actions. That’s it.

  • #286478

    Anonymous
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    @newmom 117652 wrote:

    I don’t think it took the police, handcuffs, and juvie to see this was a harmless electronic device. He wasn’t taken down away in handcuffs or to juvie because the school believed he had an actual bomb or was dangerous-if that were the case, the school would have been evacuated and the bomb squad would have been called. While you all keep defending the school’s actions, lets remember that none of that happened. None. School went on, and he was questioned at school for some amount of time before he was taken away in handcuffs. That doesn’t sound like they thought he was an actual danger to anyone.

    The school knew there was never a real THREAT or any danger. Everything the police did was because they wanted to believe he had some kind of dangerous reason for doing what he did. The situation should have ended with whatever the school consequences are for his actions. That’s it.

    I agree, I think they realized that the fake bomb wasn’t a real threat after a little investigation. But lets go back to the fake gun scenario… If the student brought a fake gun to school don’t you think they would also be questioned? They would want to know his intent and why he did what he did. Or do you think they would just take the fake gun and send him back to class?

  • #286479

    Anonymous
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    @newmom 117652 wrote:

    To say the consequences for this should be greater that eating a pop tart into some ink blot shape of a gun implies there should be consequences for the pop tart situation, which is stupid by itself. The consequences for THIS should be the same as whatever the consequences are for bringing a fake gun or other weapon to school. Was it stupid to bring the clock to school-yes. No one is saying the kid shouldn’t face the consequences.

    I don’t think a student should be suspended for a pop tart gun. That wasn’t my implication. The consequences should be the same for bringing a fake gun or other weapon to school. Which probably results in a trip to the police station or juvinile hall

  • #286387

    LC
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    Let’s keep in mind that 1) the school is not qualified to determine if a reasonably suspicious object is in fact a threat or not, nor would we want them to make those decisions, and 2) the reason he was taken into custody was on suspicion of a bomb hoax, not building a clock. He was released after questioning (which may have been the wrong decision, but that’s for speculation only).

  • #286466

    ActionEmotion
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    @adiffer 117639 wrote:

    You are guilty of dehumanizing him.
    I’m not impressed.

    HA! What garbage!

  • #286351

    adiffer
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    @CJay916 117650 wrote:

    Whether you agree or don’t agree with how the police and administration handled the situation, can we acknowledge that bringing something that looks like a bomb to a school in the current climate of our country is stupid?

    But can we admit it was a really stupid mistake. [/quote]

    No. The idiotic mistake was made by those who can’t distinguish movie bombs from reality.
    They probably expect cars to explode in collisions too, right? That’s what they do on TV and in movies.

    Quote:
    And even mistakes have consequences sometimes…

    Sure. What are the consequences for the fools who screwed this up?

  • #286388

    LC
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    From now on everyone should be careful about how that talk about Obama. The White House maintains he’s about the same as the Pope, with the same principles. We wouldn’t want to offend our Catholic and populist friends on here.

  • #286480

    Anonymous
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    @adiffer 117659 wrote:

    No. The idiotic mistake was made by those who can’t distinguish movie bombs from reality.
    They probably expect cars to explode in collisions too, right? That’s what they do on TV and in movies.

    How many bombs have you seen in person? Maybe you are an expert? I have seen zero. Therefore if something looks suspicious I am going to treat it as such.
    I also can confidently say most school administrators and most police officers haven’t seen them either. (unless they are trained or in the bomb squad)
    But apparently EVERYONE should all be experts?
    I bet if most people saw the pressure cooker during the Boston marathon they would have probably thought it was garbage and thought nothing of it. But it wasn’t was it, it was a dangerous devise that killed and injured a lot of people.

  • #286481

    Anonymous
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    @lc 117655 wrote:

    Let’s keep in mind that 1) the school is not qualified to determine if a reasonably suspicious object is in fact a threat or not, nor would we want them to make those decisions, and 2) the reason he was taken into custody was on suspicion of a bomb hoax, not building a clock. He was released after questioning (which may have been the wrong decision, but that’s for speculation only).

    NO!! he is a brilliant student who was only judged by his skin color. (Is that what its like to be a guilty liberal??) :stir:

    I’m only joking, I agree with you LC

  • #286389

    LC
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    Honestly, CJ, I can’t think of one person who regularly posts on here who is knee deep in white guilt or populist mantra–OK there are some ankle waders maybe. It’s normal for people to talk their biases. Twisting facts to suit them, or assuming one is more knowledgable than others about a topic, unless you are, is what is annoying to me.

    Al’s a physicist by academic training, and he probably doesn’t realize that to the rest of us bumpkins the thing looks like an effing bomb! You probably know as well as anyone that if a kid of any school age has a piece of licorice, points it at another kid and says “boom,” they’re in trouble. That’s maybe over the top, but it’s part of the zero tolerance policy–erring on the side of caution. This “clock” isn’t even in the same universe as a piece of candy, but there will always be the PC crowd who view that as more important than precautionary measures. I will always disagree with that.

  • #286467

    ActionEmotion
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    The fact of the matter is that bomb squads blow up back packs and suspicious looking packages all the time and they are experts. 99% of the time the packages they blow up do not contain explosives. All of this Liberal clap trap about over reaction, Islamophobia and complete disregard for their own knee jerk politically correct rules and strategies is so completely transparent to everyone but them.

    Obama is the worst American President ever to hold office and he was put there twice by the same people who brought us political correctness, the terms homophobia, islamophobia and white guilt. They lie about everything because the ends justify the means. Benghazzi and the movie, the email server, Police acting stupidly, hands up don’t shoot, black lives matter…its all hysteria built on lies.

  • #286390

    LC
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    Maybe a little dogmatic A>E? I don’t see it all as lies, just as very, very predictable populist, Western European style thinking and agenda. Where I disagree with some is that we’re over the tipping point, and I don’t think we are. Look at how Trump and Carson are polling–and most of us would agree that neither is an ideal candidate for president. Both are polling well with groups that traditionally eschew Republican candidates, so that tells us that we on the right are far from isolated in our disconnect with the current administration and their followers/supporters.

    The media is of course a huge problem, and we’ll never get them to lean right. Ever since it became OK at the Associated Press to write opinion articles posted as news, there’s a fact-free-for-all everywhere now. 24/7 news may be convenient and to some addicting, but it used to be easier when you could depend on certain publications and writers to get at least most of the facts reasonably accurate.

  • #286482

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    @CJay916 117663 wrote:

    NO!! he is a brilliant student who was only judged by his skin color. (Is that what its like to be a guilty liberal??) :stir:

    I’m only joking, I agree with you LC

    Just jokes people, hint the :stir:

    I’ve just been reading a lot of articles and comments online (about many different topics) that have been drenched in white guilt and my comedic frustrations came out on this thread.

    I read a comment that said ALL bigotry would be gone from the internet if all White Males were banned from social networking. And the person who wrote the comment had a White male as his avatar.. :confused:

  • #286391

    LC
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    This is a top down wave, and it’s taught–not implied–TAUGHT in colleges now too.

  • #286468

    ActionEmotion
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  • #286438

    newmom
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    My dog doesn’t think it looks like a bomb. Neither does my 7 year old. Would you like videos?

  • #286352

    adiffer
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    @CJay916 117662 wrote:

    How many bombs have you seen in person? Maybe you are an expert? I have seen zero. Therefore if something looks suspicious I am going to treat it as such.
    I also can confidently say most school administrators and most police officers haven’t seen them either. (unless they are trained or in the bomb squad)
    But apparently EVERYONE should all be experts?
    I bet if most people saw the pressure cooker during the Boston marathon they would have probably thought it was garbage and thought nothing of it. But it wasn’t was it, it was a dangerous devise that killed and injured a lot of people.

    My experience is with large, amateur rockets, solid fuel systems, and the circuitry that makes them go. Imagine mach 3 missiles flying through your neighborhood. That’s what I learned to do that I can talk about without getting into trouble. I’m telling you that the nonsense that gets shown for bombs on TV and in movies is what people think is real and we SHOULD be embarrassed at cuffing a kid who is bothering to learn more.

    I get it that people don’t know.
    I wish they had the humility to admit it and apologize to the kid.

  • #286353

    adiffer
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    @lc 117664 wrote:

    Al’s a physicist by academic training, and he probably doesn’t realize that to the rest of us bumpkins the thing looks like an effing bomb!

    Even you?!

    Would you be inclined to over-react, cuff a kid, and then not apologize later for your ignorance?
    Come now. These kids should be encouraged. This is the only way manufacturing comes back to America in any meaningful way.

  • #286354

    adiffer
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    @CJay916 117662 wrote:

    I bet if most people saw the pressure cooker during the Boston marathon they would have probably thought it was garbage and thought nothing of it. But it wasn’t was it, it was a dangerous devise that killed and injured a lot of people.

    It’s a matter of training, actually.
    If they saw something like that at an airport, I’d bet big money someone would report it.

    Situational awareness is something that can be learned, but we rarely bother to teach the public.
    I’m trained at work a little bit while guys like Tom saw a lot more.
    There might be a way to teach the public without scaring the pee out of them first, but I’m not sure.
    We’d need something better than those civil defense movies some of us saw as cold war kids.

    Teachers should be trained.
    Surely police officers are.

  • #286392

    LC
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    Depending on teachers to follow public safety procedures is like depending on a politician as a fiduciary. Best left to others in both cases.

  • #286469

    ActionEmotion
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    Liberal responses are so predictable, oh the poor boy. You are being scammed, worked by a clever Islamic activist and his compliant children who are succeeding in creating false narratives of Islamaphobia in the schools while making money and fame in the process. You are dupes and your insistence to hold onto this ridiculous notion that this boy needs to receive an apology is beyond naive, it’s culpable.

    This ideology is responsible for creating a climate in this country of hailing victims (real or imagined) as heroes which leads to anyone who claims offense to automatically be taken at their word, provided they are within the right demographic. The sad thing is that nothing anyone says, no evidence, no truth will ever break through the liberal blinders because all it does is generate straw man attacks, bizarre analogies and deflected arguments which supports your paper thin world view. Reagan said it best when he said “We have so many people who can’t see a fat man standing beside a thin one without coming to the conclusion that the fat man got that way by taking advantage of the thin one.” Liberals need a victim to save and if there isn’t one, they will invent one as long as they can push their agenda in the process. The sad thing is, that when there are real victims who suffer an injustice but do not support their ideology they remain quiet.

    Rush Limbaugh calls Sandra Fluke a slut and Sandra becomes the poster girl for the phony War on Women. Ed Shultz calls Laura Ingram a slut and you hear crickets. You see a woman isn’t a real woman unless she is a liberal. Just like a black man isn’t really black unless he’s a liberal. Just like the Fort Hood shooting was workplace violence but opposition to gay marriage is equal to terrorism. It would be different if there were consistency in the outrage but the glaring disproportion of indignity is far to obvious to overlook. Liberalism is a contrived form of oppression which is rooted in lies and distortion in order to impose wealth redistribution (from tax payers to politicians) and equality (everyone gets to suffer unemployment, lower wages, more expensive health care costs and over taxation) while claiming to be for the middle class (that’s what they call the poor nowadays). It is so bad that liberals can actually get away with murdering a baby, dismembering that baby and selling it’s parts to research and still get away with calling it women’s health. It is a system built on lies, supported by liars and designed to destroy any opposition by means of character assassination, violence, and punitive monetary measures.

    And you reject the depravity of man? HA! Now go on a tirade about how medicine is changing lives for the better and I’ll go read another story about some poor drugged up young man who went on a shooting spree because guns are evil.

  • #286355

    adiffer
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    @lc 117680 wrote:

    Depending on teachers to follow public safety procedures is like depending on a politician as a fiduciary. Best left to others in both cases.

    Seriously?! And we trust them with our children?

    I seem to remember they are required reporters.
    Why can’t they be trained in basic situational awareness?

  • #286356

    adiffer
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    @Action>Emotion 117685 wrote:

    Liberal responses are so predictable, oh the poor boy. You are being scammed, worked by a clever Islamic activist and his compliant children who are succeeding in creating false narratives of Islamaphobia in the schools while making money and fame in the process. You are dupes and your insistence to hold onto this ridiculous notion that this boy needs to receive an apology is beyond naive, it’s culpable.[/quote]

    All right. All right!
    I don’t want to argue about this anymore.

    Quote:
    This ideology is responsible for creating a climate in this country of hailing victims (real or imagined) as heroes which leads to anyone who claims offense to automatically be taken at their word, provided they are within the right demographic. The sad thing is that nothing anyone says, no evidence, no truth will ever break through the liberal blinders because all it does is generate straw man attacks, bizarre analogies and deflected arguments which supports your paper thin world view. Reagan said it best when he said “We have so many people who can’t see a fat man standing beside a thin one without coming to the conclusion that the fat man got that way by taking advantage of the thin one.” Liberals need a victim to save and if there isn’t one, they will invent one as long as they can push their agenda in the process. The sad thing is, that when there are real victims who suffer an injustice but do not support their ideology they remain quiet.

    Rush Limbaugh calls Sandra Fluke a slut and Sandra becomes the poster girl for the phony War on Women. Ed Shultz calls Laura Ingram a slut and you hear crickets. You see a woman isn’t a real woman unless she is a liberal. Just like a black man isn’t really black unless he’s a liberal. Just like the Fort Hood shooting was workplace violence but opposition to gay marriage is equal to terrorism. It would be different if there were consistency in the outrage but the glaring disproportion of indignity is far to obvious to overlook. Liberalism is a contrived form of oppression which is rooted in lies and distortion in order to impose wealth redistribution (from tax payers to politicians) and equality (everyone gets to suffer unemployment, lower wages, more expensive health care costs and over taxation) while claiming to be for the middle class (that’s what they call the poor nowadays). It is so bad that liberals can actually get away with murdering a baby, dismembering that baby and selling it’s parts to research and still get away with calling it women’s health. It is a system built on lies, supported by liars and designed to destroy any opposition by means of character assassination, violence, and punitive monetary measures.

    You are complaining about a straw man position I don’t hold. Rail all you want. It’s not me.

  • #286439

    newmom
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    @Action>Emotion 117685 wrote:

    Liberal responses are so predictable, oh the poor boy. You are being scammed, worked by a clever Islamic activist and his compliant children who are succeeding in creating false narratives of Islamaphobia in the schools while making money and fame in the process. You are dupes and your insistence to hold onto this ridiculous notion that this boy needs to receive an apology is beyond naive, it’s culpable.

    This ideology is responsible for creating a climate in this country of hailing victims (real or imagined) as heroes which leads to anyone who claims offense to automatically be taken at their word, provided they are within the right demographic. The sad thing is that nothing anyone says, no evidence, no truth will ever break through the liberal blinders because all it does is generate straw man attacks, bizarre analogies and deflected arguments which supports your paper thin world view. Reagan said it best when he said “We have so many people who can’t see a fat man standing beside a thin one without coming to the conclusion that the fat man got that way by taking advantage of the thin one.” Liberals need a victim to save and if there isn’t one, they will invent one as long as they can push their agenda in the process. The sad thing is, that when there are real victims who suffer an injustice but do not support their ideology they remain quiet.

    Rush Limbaugh calls Sandra Fluke a slut and Sandra becomes the poster girl for the phony War on Women. Ed Shultz calls Laura Ingram a slut and you hear crickets. You see a woman isn’t a real woman unless she is a liberal. Just like a black man isn’t really black unless he’s a liberal. Just like the Fort Hood shooting was workplace violence but opposition to gay marriage is equal to terrorism. It would be different if there were consistency in the outrage but the glaring disproportion of indignity is far to obvious to overlook. Liberalism is a contrived form of oppression which is rooted in lies and distortion in order to impose wealth redistribution (from tax payers to politicians) and equality (everyone gets to suffer unemployment, lower wages, more expensive health care costs and over taxation) while claiming to be for the middle class (that’s what they call the poor nowadays). It is so bad that liberals can actually get away with murdering a baby, dismembering that baby and selling it’s parts to research and still get away with calling it women’s health. It is a system built on lies, supported by liars and designed to destroy any opposition by means of character assassination, violence, and punitive monetary measures.

    And you reject the depravity of man? HA! Now go on a tirade about how medicine is changing lives for the better and I’ll go read another story about some poor drugged up young man who went on a shooting spree because guns are evil.

    Who here blamed it on Islamophobia?

  • #286336

    EGL Admin
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    @newmom 117690 wrote:

    Who here blamed it on Islamophobia?

    I don’t think he said anyone here said that. I think he is saying liberals in general.

    I am not sure this was some type of plan, without some evidence. Connecting the dots doesn’t work unless you really believe this is a plan. How could they know this would have been the end result? That the school and police would react how they did and then Obama and others would react how they did? I don’t believe that any more than I believe 9/11 was planned. Once it happened, I can see the dad using it to his advantage and making it a media story. I think the school did the right thing. I think the cops overreacted by cuffing him and taking him in without more of a reason.

  • #286470

    ActionEmotion
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    @EGL Admin 117703 wrote:

    I don’t think he said anyone here said that. I think he is saying liberals in general.

    I am not sure this was some type of plan, without some evidence. Connecting the dots doesn’t work unless you really believe this is a plan. How could they know this would have been the end result? That the school and police would react how they did and then Obama and others would react how they did? I don’t believe that any more than I believe 9/11 was planned. Once it happened, I can see the dad using it to his advantage and making it a media story. I think the school did the right thing. I think the cops overreacted by cuffing him and taking him in without more of a reason.

    Because this is the second time this family has done this bomb scare crap, the first time it was the daughter who said that she wanted to blow up the school, she was suspended and the father tried this islamophobia claim back then. This time, they got a whole lot more mileage out of their scam.

  • #286393

    LC
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    @Action>Emotion 117718 wrote:

    Because this is the second time this family has done this bomb scare crap, the first time it was the daughter who said that she wanted to blow up the school, she was suspended and the father tried this islamophobia claim back then. This time, they got a whole lot more mileage out of their scam.

    You have this from a reliable source? If that’s the case, then that might change some minds about that halo people seem to assume Ahmed is wearing.

  • #286394

    LC
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    Looks like there could be something to this, but of course you have to go into the weeds to find it, unless you don’t consider Breitbart the weeds (I don’t–it’s one of the few right wing blogs that are quite reliable)..This is from the original interview by the left leaning Daily Beast, however. His sister denies it was she who made the threat. The family apparently did not dispute the suspension.

    After the MSNBC segment, Eyman and I sit down in the hallway where she says the same thing happened to her as Ahmed.
    “I got suspended from school for three days from this stupid same district, from this girl saying I wanted to blow up the school, something I had nothing to do with.”
    Eyman talks with the slightest lisp, almost imperceptible, but it becomes stronger as she gets emotional.
    “I got suspended and I didn’t do anything about it and so when I heard about Ahmed, I was so mad because it happened to me and I didn’t get to stand up, so I’m making sure he’s standing up because it’s not right. So I’m not jealous, I’m kinda like—it’s like he’s standing for me.”
    Eyman said her suspension was in her first year of middle school, “my first year of attempting middle school in America. I knew English, but the culture was different, the people were different.”

  • #286453

    violarose
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    You guys make me exhausted.

  • #286395

    LC
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    I think that some people have jumped on some kind of guilt trip or political thing without standing back and looking at the big picture. Some of us are a little reserved in making judgments at the outset. I think we all agree that “facts” are few and far between on this one, leading all of us to view the possible motive and outcome with different lenses. I had a suspicion it was a set up from day one, and I think the big names like Obama that jumped on this were taken as fools. That’s just my opinion. Unless the kid gets fully busted, and that’s highly unlikely with the media all on his side, he gets credit for a 14 year old pulling it off.

  • #286357

    adiffer
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    @lc 117719 wrote:

    You have this from a reliable source? If that’s the case, then that might change some minds about that halo people seem to assume Ahmed is wearing.

    It would.

  • #286396

    LC
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    Have to say I’m pretty surprised that any conventional media, especially one that has always been left leaning, has followed up on this story, but the Dallas Morning News has, and as suspected, there’s a little more to young Ahmed’s story that has been published previously:

    “He was a weird little kid,” said Kubiak, now 62 and retired. “I saw a lot of him in me. That thirst for knowledge … he’s one of those kids that could either be CEO of a company or head of a gang.”

    Fantastic Inventions and a Fight With Authority

  • #286337

    EGL Admin
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    Well that adds a lot more to the story.

  • #286471

    ActionEmotion
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    @violarose 117730 wrote:

    You guys make me exhausted.

    Getting to the truth is exhausting especially with a media, entertainment industry and education all supporting the same ideology. But that’s what it takes to side step the spin and find the facts.

  • #286397

    LC
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    Did he ever make it to the White House? Obama can’t be that busy–he certainly isn’t paying much attention to Syria or Russia–or did he finally realize he’d been bamboozled by a 14 year old?

  • #286483

    Anonymous
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    @Action>Emotion 117885 wrote:

    Getting to the truth is exhausting especially with a media, entertainment industry and education all supporting the same ideology. But that’s what it takes to side step the spin and find the facts.

    You mean we actually have to put our emotions aside, be logical, and look at the facts beyond just the Hashtags??? :biggrin: :stir:

  • #286484

    Anonymous
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    @lc 117886 wrote:

    Did he ever make it to the White House? Obama can’t be that busy–he certainly isn’t paying much attention to Syria or Russia–or did he finally realize he’d been bamboozled by a 14 year old?

    If he did, I bet the secret service examined his “Clock” very thoroughly…

  • #286398

    LC
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    I think once we fold our arms and state that we have the facts, we’ve lost our requisite investigative mode and *may* consider the data factual because it is consistent with our bias. In this case, the more recent data agrees with my initial suspicion from the start, but that does not make it factual, as most of the statements are from moderately interested third parties.

  • #286440

    newmom
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    I don’t think the story you posted changes anything at all. It says a suspension for fighting to defendi himself was lifted, and he got in trouble another time for what we don’t know-possibly blowing bubbles. A friend of my daughters- a straight A kid, never been in trouble a day in her life- got suspended for 3 days recently for instigating a fight. What really happened? She overheard a girl saying she was going to beat the crap out of another girl, and my daughter’s friend told the girl as a warning. When the potential victim went to the administration they took the warning my daughters friend made as an effort to create a problem and instigate. There was no reasoning with them and she was suspended. So things happen to good kids all the time. His story doesn’t change the actions the police took that day. There was no reason for most of the reactions that took place that day.

  • #286338

    EGL Admin
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    ^^^^^^

    @lc 117895 wrote:

    I think once we fold our arms and state that we have the facts, we’ve lost our requisite investigative mode and *may* consider the data factual because it is consistent with our bias. In this case, the more recent data agrees with my initial suspicion from the start, but that does not make it factual, as most of the statements are from moderately interested third parties.

  • #286441

    newmom
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    You don’t think there is a difference between getting in trouble for defending yourself at school and building a pretend bomb?

  • #286339

    EGL Admin
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    Depends

  • #286399

    LC
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    I will give Newmom credit for tenacity. She may be wrong from the start, but she don’ nevah give up!

  • #286492

    plasmadrive
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    @newmom 117900 wrote:

    You don’t think there is a difference between getting in trouble for defending yourself at school and building a pretend bomb?

    He didn’t build a “pretend bomb”. Newmom, have you been reading this with your eyes closed? This kid got in trouble (this time) for doing nothing more than what many of us did as kids.. took stuff apart and put it back together. It was a clock for crying out loud. Building digital clocks was one of the most replicated projects in school for electronics types.

    Again, this all comes back to people fearing what they don’t understand. In this case it was some teacher, then the principle and then the cops (who should have known better).

  • #286442

    newmom
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    Plasma, have you been reading with your eyes closed? Look back at what I have written all along. I have said every step that his pencil box wasn’t a brief case, was too small to be a brief case, didn’t look like a bomb, etc. Others on this board seem to believe it did look like a bomb and was supposed to look like a bomb to create the exact situation that happened. I do NOT agree that he was targeted because of his religion though. However, I also disagree that the article LC posted paints him to be a perpetual problem child who defies authority. I think there is a huge stretch between a kid getting suspended for defending himself from a bully and then getting accused of building a bomb or being involved in a bomb hoax.

  • #286493

    plasmadrive
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    @newmom 117914 wrote:

    Plasma, have you been reading with your eyes closed? Look back at what I have written all along. I have said every step that his pencil box wasn’t a brief case, was too small to be a brief case, didn’t look like a bomb, etc. Others on this board seem to believe it did look like a bomb and was supposed to look like a bomb to create the exact situation that happened. I do NOT agree that he was targeted because of his religion though. However, I also disagree that the article LC posted paints him to be a perpetual problem child who defies authority. I think there is a huge stretch between a kid getting suspended for defending himself from a bully and then getting accused of building a bomb or being involved in a bomb hoax.

    I was only commenting on your “pretend bomb” comment.. It wasn’t a pretend bomb….

    Truly you are correct that it is a pencil box and have said that all along. I also agree with some of your other comments..

    I don’t think the other article is actually relevant to be honest with you. Many kids get in minor trouble throughout the school years…

    BTW, I always read with my eyes closed… :sarcastic

  • #286340

    EGL Admin
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    At first glance most people won’t know it’s not a bomb. Is a backpack a bomb? No one would have thought so until Boston a few years ago. Now anytime a backpack is left behind it is considered a bomb. When most of us were kids none of this stuff was really happening. No one would have thought a clock was a bomb. So you really can’t compare taking apart a clock then with now. How many people took apart a clock at home and then brought it to school? Why would you bring it to school? As far as the other story about this kid’s history, sure it’s relevant. Some kids get in trouble a lot, most kids don’t. If it’s happens more than a couple of times then it’s a pattern of behavior and you can’t just discount it because he was defending himself or bringing a clock to school. Sounds like his teacher knew the kid had an attitude. One of our friends has a son that is sort of like this kid. He’s really smart and loves to tinker with things. He also thinks he is smarter than the teachers and adults and sometimes gets in trouble for that. He’s the type that would bring something like this to school and joke it was a bomb or something. Some kids are that way. It’s not something all kids or even more than a few do though.

    The pencil box/briefcase debate is semantics and depends on your definition. The case it was in was not a a typical pencil box that I have ever seen. Go to Staples. They don’t have anything the size of what he had

  • #286443

    newmom
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    Are you sure about Staples?
    And the pencil box vs. briefcase IS relevant. If you hear the kid brought his clock to school in a pencil box with a tiger hologram on the front, you aren’t thinking something dangerous. You are thinking of a kid tinkering in his house. If hear he brought it in a briefcase, you are thinking something larger, more professional, and more dangerous.

    http://www.staples.com/Vaultz-2-1-4-x-8-1-4-Locking-Pencil-Box-Black/product_1274076

  • #286400

    LC
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    All anyone has to do to determine if a container is bomb or not is look at the WCBSS (World Council on Bomb Size Standards). They never vary. No bombs have ever been smaller than a briefcase, because it would be physically impossible to fit a timer chip and plastic explosives in anything smaller. Plus, it would be a violation of the WCBSS.

  • #286444

    newmom
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    And again-IF there was such a fear that this was ever a REAL bomb-why wasn’t the school evacuated or the bomb squad called to check out the device?

    Exactly. They knew no one was in danger.

  • #286401

    LC
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    Why was he detained in custody, then? Exactly. Bomb hoax.

  • #286494

    plasmadrive
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    @lc 117926 wrote:

    All anyone has to do to determine if a container is bomb or not is look at the WCBSS (World Council on Bomb Size Standards). They never vary. No bombs have ever been smaller than a briefcase, because it would be physically impossible to fit a timer chip and plastic explosives in anything smaller. Plus, it would be a violation of the WCBSS.

    LMAO!! :funny3:

  • #286445

    newmom
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    @lc 117931 wrote:

    Why was he detained in custody, then? Exactly. Bomb hoax.

    They knew it wasn’t a bomb, but decided it wasn’t the clock he said it was. That’s on them, not him. They decided it was supposed to look like a bomb, not him.
    Yes, he should still be in trouble and face the consequences and his suspension, but the detaining him, cuffing him, and juvie were stupid and ridiculous.

  • #286341

    EGL Admin
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    They should have tazed him.

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